Post Mortems
Arrow Laurel Dies Spoilers

Arrow Boss Clears the Air on [Spoiler]'s 'Vicious' Death and Star's Reaction, Braces for 'Rather Loud' Fan Response

Warning: The following contains major spoilers for Wednesday’s Arrow.

Damien Dahrk has made his point, in brutal fashion.

Speaking 1-on-1 with TVLine, Arrow showrunner Marc Guggenheim says that the eventual decision of who to put in the flash-forward mystery grave was born out of a desire to “move the show forward” in a way that impacts as many characters as possible.

So, as Team Arrow set out to thwart Damien Darhk’s Malcolm Merlyn-assisted prison break, it was Laurel Lance aka Black Canary — played by original cast member Katie Cassidy — who found herself on the business end of an arrow, with Darhk twisting it into her gut for good measure. Later, at the hospital, the would-be DA succumbed to her wound, though not before bidding Oliver and others an emotional farewell.

TVLine spoke with Guggenheim about the decision process that led to Laurel’s tragic demise, having that “hard conversation” with original cast member Cassidy, and which team members will be particularly affected by the loss. Plus: Who’s the new girl in town?

TVLINE | Eighty-seven episodes and out for Miss Katie Cassidy. This was a big one, man. I even got verklempt talking about it to someone the other day.
Yeah. This was big. I think it’s fair to say, without any disrespect to any of the other actors we’ve killed off — and lord knows there’s probably enough to spin off another show! — this is clearly theArrow-Laurel-Dies-Katie-Cassidy biggest one we’ve done.

TVLINE | What were the arguments for and against the death being Laurel?
The argument against it was the fact that we all love Katie. We love working with Katie, we love having her on the show. We love the fact that she plays Black Canary. [Another reason is] quite frankly the fact that there would be some corners of the Internet who in a season where Oliver got engaged to Felicity would interpret this as us choosing a side in the “shipper wars.” With respect to that last point, we felt like we had told the Oliver/Laurel love story in Season 1, and we had no intention of getting them back together. We never felt like we had to kill off Laurel to put an end to that story.

TVLINE | Right, and you did give them some really nice callbacks this season. They had some talks that they needed to have.
I think so, too. A lot of those talks were written before we even made the decision [to kill Laurel]. When we went into the season, we really went in with an eye towards repairing the Oliver/Laurel relationship and moving them into a “friend” place — and a “good friend” place. ArrowThose little moments weren’t to lay the foundation for a death we didn’t know was coming. Rather, as with the beginning of any season, we start off with a list of things we want to accomplish, and one of those things was to move Oliver and Laurel to a new, more healthy place. I was very glad we got a chance to do that. The scenes were very, very effective.

The reason to [kill Laurel off] is it is big. It is bold. It does move the show forward. It does impact all of our characters. Diggle and Thea in particular will be making a lot of choices from now until the end of the season that are directly influenced by the events of this episode. Fundamentally, whenever we kill off a character, it usually comes down to, “How will this death impact all the other characters?” Then there’s also the feeling of: We’ve had Laurel be in love with Oliver, fall out of love with Oliver… be in love with Tommy, lose Tommy… hit bottom, have a drug addiction… rise up, become the Black Canary….

TVLINE | Get invited to be the DA….
Get invited to be the DA…. But the truth is — and bear in mind, this is the lawyer/legal writer in me speaking — every time we’ve tried to set scenes in a courtroom, I don’t think it’s always been the strongest element of the show. It has nothing to do with the directors, the actors or anything. The show is just not built for that, and I feel like every time we do it, it shows. Some people occasionally tweet at me, “Why don’t we see Laurel in the courtroom more?” Honestly, it’s very expensive to go on location, and when we do it the scenes always fall flat for some reason.

TVLINE | It’s a very real thing within a slightly surreal world.
Yes. There’s that, and there’s also the argument to be made that television legal dramas are kind of an old genre. It’s hard to keep the camera moving in a dynamic way, so the show feels like it slows down. Long story short, we were looking ahead toward Season 5 and we were like,Arrow “It kind of feels like Laurel’s story has come to a very organic… if not “conclusion,” certainly a “plateau.”

Look, you’re going to publish this and the people who love Laurel and love Katie are going to say we didn’t try hard enough, that we have failed this character. And I fully respect their point of view — they’re very vocal and very passionate. Katie and the show are lucky to have them. But at the end of the day, we have to tell the story we’re telling, and we did it in spite of what we imagine will be a rather loud response from a very vocal minority.

TVLINE | How did Katie take the news? Did the fact that a death had been teased in the season-opening flash-forward soften the blow at all?
I would say probably not. Look, it’s a hard conversation for both parties to have, for the showrunner and the actor. And we’ve had a few of them. I will say that Katie, from that conversation to when she show wrapped, has been a class act all the way. She’s been so professional and so gracious. And what’s kind of nice is the fact that [Arrow, The Flash and DC’s Legends of Tomorrow] have introduced different elements [that allow for improbable returns], so fundamentally no one is ever gone for good. In fact, right after we show wrapped Katie on Arrow, she signed on to be in [CW Seed’]s Vixen Season 2, she signed on to be in an episode of Flash. I said to her that between the three shows we have time travel, resurrection, parallel universes and flashbacks — dead does not mean goodbye. I meant it when I said it, and lo and behold within the space of a month there are two more instances where she’s working for us. Again, I’ve got to give Katie a lot of credit. There are a lot of actors who would have been petulant. They would have had a colorful response.

TVLINE | But this isn’t her first rodeo. She’s been on a lot of shows. She is a pro.
She is such a pro. And that’s one of the things she said — “I know the way this business works and the way this show works.” One of these days, I swear to God, we’re going to kill off a character who’s played by an actor we don’t like, and it will probablyarrow-black-canary-dies feel very different. But the truth of the matter is everyone’s who has died on the show have all been [played by] genuinely wonderful people. Katie, in addition to being a pro, is also in possession of a really good story sense. She’s always understood the show very well, she’s understood her character very well. It didn’t require a lot of explanation or persuasion for us to articulate what this story development would do for the series going forward. She’s a really smart cookie.

TVLINE | Were any other manners of death for Laurel considered?
We did talk about a lot of different things. “Does Damien use his magic on her in a more direct way?” We talked about all of the various ways, quite frankly, you can kill someone. This felt to us in the writers room as the most sort of… “poetic” is the wrong word…

TVLINE | “Live by the arrow, die by the arrow?”
Damien is using Oliver’s own weapon against her. That’s a particular kind of viciousness.

TVLINE | Quentin didn’t get to say goodbye to Laurel. Why the decision to again heap that extra bit of hurt upon the poor guy?
I’ll be totally frank with you — I don’t remember. I just remember being in the writers room and pitching out this moment, where Oliver walks out of the room, Lance comes around the corner, Lance sees the look on Oliver, and he immediately knows.

TVLINE | The team of course is now down a man, and at a critical time. Is that perhaps where the mystery character being played by Madison McLaughlin comes in? To maybe eventually fill that void?
I don’t want to spoil it, honestly. Madison is terrific, she’s in Episode 19 in a circumstance that is very dependent upon the events of [this week’s episode]. [Arrow writer] Brain Ford Sullivan pitched a very interesting story involving her character that is something we haven’t done on the show, and is something I don’t think any show has ever done.

TVLINE | That’s plenty cryptic, but I can work with it.
Cryptic is what I do, man!

Click here to read Katie Cassidy’s own thoughts on Laurel’s death.

Comments are monitored, so don’t go off topic, don’t frakkin’ curse and don’t bore us with how much your coworker’s sister-in-law makes per hour. Talk smart about TV!

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  1. and I’m only watching Flash at this point. You literally had Laurel say “go be with Felicity” at the end.

    • stacy030 says:

      Yeah, I truly don’t care about shipping or anti-shipping or whatever. But that line did seem like a pretty major F-you to Laurel’s fans.

      • Phoenix5634 says:

        Kind of agree.
        But everything in that scene besides that line was really well done, you could really feel the emotion in the room. I’m going to miss Laurel now. Bring her back please showrunners.

        • SHONDA LAUREL says:

          I am really surprised it was Laurel, I thought for sure it would be Diggle. Glad I was wrong.

          • Brandi says:

            I am shocked too. I thought it was going to be Quinton or mamma Smoak. Never ever thought they would really kill off the Black Canary no matter who played her. I’m kind of sad.

          • Julieann says:

            I was thinking it was Donna Smoak until recently when I found out she was in later episodes

          • donholley77 says:

            That’s what I thought too! Glad we were both wrong!

        • Diggle’s brother needs to go. In some ways, he is responsible for Laurel’s death as Darhk. John will now go through a traumatic emotional arc due to his complicity by trusting his brother, and bringing him into the prison with the missing piece of the icon. If the writers could have done a do-over, the grave scene should have been Diggle and Oliver instead of Barry. As much as I like Neal O’Donough, I would like to see this story reach its conclusion.

      • GUSTAVO. ALCALA says:


        • Patricia Samuelson says:

          LOL! Gustavo you’re hilarious! Rebecca Merlin! First she’s his wife now she’s his daughter? LOL! BTW she’s the new Black Canary And Thea and Tommy Merlin’s sister??? She must have been in Nanda Parbat this WHOLE time training with Ras Alghul.. who Knew! LOL! The Merlin Family is more messed up than anyone knew.

    • Dude says:

      I mostly liked the way her ending was crafted but that line felt like a pretty big slap in the face. We could have lived without ONE scene being about Olicity and that should have been one of them.

    • 134sc says:

      U mm, what? She said no such thing. She just acknowledged that she is happy Oliver found Felicity. She was happy for her friend, all the while looking back fondly on what she and Oliver used to have. Thats how I read that scene and I’m not a shipper, so I don’t have a horse in the race.

      • excarkun says:

        Wow..I do believe you need to watch it again ..I just did and your wrong she does say it…so I Can see why they think that. It be great if the show moves more to the arrow in comics story line ..but the more they don’t the more likely ill stop watching..

    • AddiM says:

      “…..and we did it in spite of what we imagine will be a rather loud response from a very vocal minority.”
      Shameful way to try and disregard fans feelings by labeling them as ‘vocal minority’ Guggenheim.
      I’m not overly upset because I only warmed up to Laurel this season; but I would have loved to see her grow in her role as BC. It does seem like Laurel’s death was a way to shut up the Lauriver shippers and fans alike for good.

      • Paul says:

        I’m certain they check very carefully before they kill a character. The character has to be loved by at least a few, and the louder they are the better for the show. No such thing as bad publicity. But the character can’t be loved by too many, or the show will lose too much audience. Whatever producers might say about creativity, you know they have folks constantly assessing the popularity of characters, especially on shows like this that kill characters off. So I’m certain that Guggenheim is aware of at least roughly how many of the show’s fans would be hyper angry about this. And I’m certain he knows whether that number is a minority or not and whether they’re vocal or not. All one need do is look at message boards, like this one, to find that out. So he told you the truth, and you regard that as shameful? Would you prefer a candy-coated lie?

        • AddiM says:

          Saying that in a way to try and shut up fans is wrong…vocal minority or not their voices deserve to be heard. Anyway it’s always a very small fraction of overall tv audiences that engage in social media or message board discussions about shows…so Guggenheim should not act like all voices on message boards & social media alike are not in the minority compared to the entire audience

          • Marialy says:

            I have to say I agree with addiM I am doing so now because I read your comment but I never go on social media or post comments about anything however I had to for the comment he made I did not agree with how they killed laurel to shut up the “vocal minority” not every one has to vocal about their feelings and it doesn’t not make them a minority group simply by what is posted.

      • Jeremy says:

        Laurel and Oliver hadn’t been in a romantic relationship of any kind since season one. Even if they didn’t kill her, I doubt it would have ever been rekindled.

    • John NYC says:

      Really unnecessary.

      But the death wasn’t a “ship” move?


    • Agree it was totally unnecessary.

    • Murica! says:

      It was pathetic. The writers will do anything to make Olicity fans happy. They are their puppets. Thank you Olicity fans for ruining the show!!

      • Birdie says:

        Totally agree Im sick and tired of the Olicity fans and Olicity. They should had never pair up Oliver and Felicity in the first place. Felicity was just fine being the sidekick tech girl in charge of the tech stuff athte Arrow laird, they the writers or the EP could not keep it taht way or at least keep it for a while. They ruined ithe show the moment the writers made Oliver and Felicity a couple last season, The atom dude ( I cant recall his name now). Im not saying Oliver did not need to have a gf but not Felicity and better another lady who did not work with him, as once they worked together conflict of interests arised and love cloud their jdugements. Felicity became a selfish pathetic woman, only she thought of herself and got mad at Oliver when he did not tell her about his son. Oliver sacrifice his son and he made a promise to the mother not to tell anyone in order to protect him. Why cant Felicity understand that? She is not a mother to know that parents sometiems made sacrifices. No, Felicity only thought of her well being and noone else. Im glad Mr Terrific is stepping in, Felicity is selfish and she better off with herself for a time.

    • Jerry says:

      For real I may not watch arrow again if there’s no laurel/Oliver love story. #bringbacklaurel or lose a loyal fan

      • Sarah John says:

        Tell me about it. Loved the whole thing til Olicity started.. AND NOW BC IS DEAD. Bye-bye season 5, you’re not worth it

    • Brad Avery says:

      Im done with Arrow: It really sucks now PERIOD

    • GUSTAVO ALCALA says:


    • Liz says:

      Me too. : /

    • Carolyn says:

      I am done with Arrow. I thought maybe the 2 would get back together. I cannot stand him w Felicity.

  2. xomar says:

    And that was the series finale for me, Laurel was the only reason I still stuck around, I hope the people who continue watching enjoy it, because I won’t be able to.

    • MLO says:

      She’s not dead. Well, she’s dead, but she’s not gone. Before she died, she leaned into Oliver and asked him to kill her so she could be resurrected through the Lazarus pit. That gives her the bloodlust and will allow her to defeat Darhk. Sooooo formulaic.

      Didn’t anyone find it weird that she was perfectly fine, she’s asked Oliver for a favor and then she died? And Oliver didn’t cry?

      • K says:

        Too bad Nyssa destroyed the Lazarus pit…

        • Phoenix5634 says:

          Do you watch Legends? Sara was standing beside an active Lazarus pit last episode. How do you think Sara will react when she returns? Rip is doing his mission to save his son, I imagine he’d let Sara save Laurel

          • Nightflame says:

            Do you watch Legends? That was in 1960 with the Lazarus Pit, not 2016. In the present time, there is no Pit.

          • D says:

            Standing next to one in 1960… Do you watch the show?!

          • Phoenix5634 says:

            When Sara returns she’ll have the waverider. And there’s a season 2 of Legends.

          • Ryan Karolak says:

            Other than that was the pit fifty years in the past, not today, they can find a way to bring her (or some version of her) back if they wanted. In shows like this there is always a way. That’s how Wells remained on the show in Flash. We’ll see Cassidy on at least one episode of the Flash, as her duplicate from Earth-2.

            It seams clear to be that she’s gone for now and the foreseeable future, but if they want her to guest-star or return they will find a way to do so.

      • Dysturbed says:

        It’s probably safe to say that definitely isn’t what she whispered to Oliver, cause while we know that it is still active if they go back in time, Laurel herself is unaware of that.

      • do you watch this show?!! Lazarus Pit is gone, it was destroyed among others coz of LL actions and this is irony. I’m sure she asked Oliver to stay in the mayoral race and be hero without the mask, and Oliver will be mayor.

      • dan says:

        Precisely. This was an okey doke if ever I’ve seen one. Keeping her busy on other shows is part of the deal, keep food on her table so she doesn’t have to get another job before her triumphant return and I love it. The team is going to be so pissed at Oliver.

        • Duncan Beach says:

          Yes, well, keep in mind that at 7pm central time, plenty of little kids (as opposed to DC’s psychopathic fan base or a bunch of boy-crazed teenyboppers) watched Black Canary DIE. Put that in your pipe and smoke it.

  3. Tony says:

    This guy has run the show into the ground. What a hack.

    • tvjunkie says:

      Eventually we’ll all be able to look back at this episode as the Jump The Shark moment. A lot of people don’t realize it now because they are blinded by the Olicity daytime soap opera that’s been the A story of this season. It’s also a slap in the face to anyone with a brain to deny the reason behind this is 100% Olicity, because it obviously is. I’m rooting for Darhk to win now and put this mess out of it’s misery.

      • Phoenix5634 says:

        Agree pretty much. I definitely want the Darhk storyline to be the A story. And I also blame this seasons downfall on Olicity, mostly the Felicity part. I’m sure for some people it was the Oliver part. But in my opinion she changed Oliver for the worse.

        • JGoodyP says:

          Amen. I can’t be the only one who didn’t believe they were getting Oliver and Felicity together when it first happened. It felt insanely forced and unnatural. Every episode they r had moments together over each season I still go “really? Is this real? Still?”
          The writers apparently felt it was natural progression that Laurel and Oliver become friends and move on and the book on them getting together was closed for good – THEY HAVE MORE CHEMISTRY THAN OLIVER AND FELICITY, AND THATS IN THE FACE OF YOUR TRYING TO WRITE THEM APART. Come on, if I don’t watch another episode it’s not because I’m pissed a character died, it’s because this writer moron is out of touch with the stuff he writes and how the characters play on screen. That’s a guaranteed recipe for. Failed show.

          • Liz says:

            Yes seriously, agree. Guggenheim and others are out of touch with the characters they have written AND on screen chemistry between actors.
            And yes I always wonder too, is this still happening?!
            Definitely forced.

  4. A. D. says:

    What crap!

  5. NM says:

    A fan favourite or not, this was a cheap stunt to live up to a “promise” to viewers. Nothing more. Not even well thought out. I understood killing off Sara to give the Black Canary title to Laurel. However, going back on your words for a cheap shot like this is ridiculous story telling. Whether Sara is now alive or not, killing of Laurel was a stupid mistake. The writers have only decided to kill off this character, because they’ve hit their own writers block with story telling. It’s the only reason they kill off every main character when they can’t work out what to do with them. Roy being the only exception.

    • MLo says:

      She’s not dead. Watch. She needed the bloodlust Thea told her about to defeat Damian.

      • excarkun says:

        God I hope your wrong. Because that story telling is getting old…maybe of they have too this should be the final season….

      • NM says:

        If the writers did that than I’d be even more frustrated. You don’t screw with your viewers. They’re the reasons you have jobs.

      • tvjunkie says:

        She’s dead, there is no more Pit, it was destroyed. To travel back in time to use the pit would be even worse writing. Even a 5th grader could write a better story than that.

        • michael says:

          In the comics, there was more than one Lazarus Pit in the world. Whether or not that applies to the “Arrowverse,” I don’t know.

    • I read dc says:

      Roy was supposed to be speedy Rory was not supposed to disappear until he became the red arrow and left Big Green Arrow to do his own thing Speedy was a drug addict male that Oliver found and turned into the red arrow

  6. Mike R says:

    You don’t kill the Black Canary in a show about the Green Arrow. I can’t believe even her final scene pandered to olicity. Just ugly

    • Sam says:

      100000x this!! Absolutely shameful.

    • tvjunkie says:

      Yep the words JUMP THE SHARK have never applied as well to any show as they do to this episode.

    • John NYC says:

      That was just so rude to the character.

      AND told the lie to her death not being about the ship.

    • tvjunkie says:

      It’s also rather dsiappointing how Matt seems to be smooching the backside of the showrunner in this interview. I have a lot of respect for Matt, he’s one of the best, but this the sunshine blowing in this interview is something I thought was beneath him.

  7. Joni says:

    I’m glad she’s gone. I’ve never cared for the character.

    • Maria says:

      Same. I’m sorry but this is typical Hollywood fluff talk. You have to appear nice on interviews and sure she can be a “professional,” but, her liking those tweets tells us everything but her being professional.

      The show was never about her. People acting like they can’t kill BC don’t know this show. This show is Oliver’s and look what they did to him in season 3×09 just so she can have a three episode arc again for the third season.

      • NM says:

        The character of Laurel was never well received, but that was mostly due to her season 2 arc of addiction/grieving Tommy. From there, the death of Sara and Laurel taking over the role of Black Canary didn’t help her with fans. Still, the death of Laurel was a cheap blow to the her and fans of the character. She has to remain professional, seeing as she’s out of a job and has to look for a new one. Still, to say the show is about “Green Arrow” is a strong remark to make seeing as The Black Canary played an integral role in the character’s journey.

      • Fernanda says:

        This show is Oliver’s??? sorry.. this show is Olicity’s… much worse

  8. Shawn says:

    This whole interview is just disgusting. A spit in the fave of the character and katie. Rodeo? Vocal minority? Are you’d serious? Screw u both.

    Screw this show.

  9. thanks to the multiverse there is more than one Black Canary out there

  10. SHONDA LAUREL says:

    Not sure there will be fan outcry, I didn’t think her character was well liked, at least not in my timeline.

  11. Lauren says:

    This is one of my big problems with TV. For show runners it’s not about the community that watches, it’s about making it easier for them in the writers room. I don’t say this as a huge fan of Laurel, but as a fan of good writing. Make no mistake, there were and there always are OTHER story lines that will work and that make sense. This was a senseless killing of someone, that was finally written as a woman with strength and bravery, that could have continued to be part of great story telling. Now she will be replaced with another MALE hero.

    • 134sc says:

      In my opinion it shouldn’t be about the community, it should be about the story the writers want too tell. If this death, free up some creativity then good for theme. As fans we have the right to say we liked or didn’t like something, but we shouldn’t have the right to tell the writers what to do.

      • Lauren says:

        No, I was just pointing out that there were other stories. This was not the only way that they could have upped the ante. in no way did I tell him what to do or what to write, but I did point out that this wasn’t his ONLY choice. They didn’t start out this arch saying we have a good reason to kill Laurel they started it out saying we’re going to kill someone just to kill someone. So they just picked someone. They didn’t have a good reason to do it except they’d said they would, and this wasn’t a story they had to tell.

    • NM says:

      Keeping in mind they’re going to replace an employering woman with a gay man. It’s as if they think killing off one part of equality that it’s that simple to replace it with another. How insulting.

    • Lizzie says:

      No just no! You can’t say it’s about the community and then have 50 million comments about writer pandering about Olicity running the show. I’m sorry but Laurel was always the outlier in this show. For her to be black canary she could never get her own good storyline and that wasn’t the writer fault. Katie is a fine actress I just think she necessaryly mesched with anyone. Her chemistry was always flimsy with everyone else. So I’m ok with this decision her character just never did anything for me.

    • Liz985 says:

      The Arrow writers don’t know what to do with strong female characters. They killed Moira, Sarah (twice!), Shado, and Amanda W., neutered Nyssa, sidelined Tatsu, and tried to kill Thea. I’m not a Felicity fan but, yeah, they tried to kill her, too. I mean, there’s a Women’s Studies graduate thesis in there somewhere about male insecurities and violence against women in the CW/DC-verse (that last part is said with tongue firmly in cheek ;-) )

  12. justtobesane says:

    Hated it.

  13. Lysh says:

    I don’t care about TV shows being just like the comics – I know things just happen on TV where it takes a different turn. But she’s the Black Canary. Over the three Arrowverse shows, they could use another strong female actual suited-up superheroine. I think I need a drink tbh.

  14. As someone who only semi-likes Laurel (and someone who ships Olicity) I definitely think that Laurel and Katie Cassidy (and her fans) deserved a whole lot better than that episode.

  15. Fox says:

    They not only killed Laurel but had her prop up freaking Olicity in her last moments. Really?? It’s ridiculous how these writers have run this show into the ground. This episode was the series finale for me. I’ll remember this series for what it used to be during the first 2 seasons before it became the Felicity show.

    • Marj says:

      Why do people say it’s the Felicity show? She (Felicity) wasn’t even in the episode. And if you have been following the show, everyone and the cat knew where Oliver’s heart lies…Laurel saying it aloud (or not) changes nothing. I find it funny that some people keep harping on Arrow being F’s show because hello…up to this season, we knew nothing about her at all (her and Diggle’s back story has been shelved for so long) whereas we’ve had the Lance family drama for how many episodes/season plus her BC arc where Oliver had to basically “die” so she can have it…Imagine that? Actually ‘killing’ the guy whose name bears the show’s title for her arc to be front and center and yet nobody said it has become the BC show…And really at the end of the day, the show is not Arrow & Black Canary…It’s just Arrow…

      • Marj says:

        I mean F wasn’t in the episode except that last part…

        • tofeggari says:

          I agree. I do not understand why people are freaking out? I mean, we all knew that Oliver loves Felicity, and why does it matter that Laurel was. Big enough person to say it out loud? She clearly knew she was dying, and felt like she wanted to come clean. In addition people who think that she’s coming back to life? She’s not. Read the interviews. No, Oliver didn’t kill her.

      • tvjunkie says:

        You’d have to be blind or stupid or both not to see the Olicity has been the A story of this season and Darhk/Hive has been the B story. Arrow has turned into a daytime soap opera. They should just go ahead and rename the show Olicity.

  16. Phoenix5634 says:

    When the Legends return from their mission I hope Sara gets Rip to let them go back to the League in another time, and use the Lazarus pit to revive her. Sara has been talking about getting back home the whole time, and when she finally does Laurels dead. Rip is doing this whole mission to save his son, let Sara save Laurel!

  17. peterwdawson says:

    See I keep wondering if this ties into the old DC mandate with their adaptations about trying not to have a character appear in multiple continuities. Back in the days of the DCAU they had to eventually drop anyone related to Batman who wasn’t Batman, Aquaman and from the get go couldn’t use anyone tied to the Teen Titans. They’ve dropped the Suicide Squad and Amanda Waller due to the Suicide Squad film, I wouldn’t be at all surprised if we learn Black Canary’s going to appear in the DCCU as well.

    • Lysh says:

      Interesting comment. I’m still going to see Suicide Squad, but I’m lowkey mad at them because I love Arrow’s Deadshot (and that whole SS story had potential). Maybe a Birds of Prey movie? I kinda doubt it but interesting thought!

    • Phoenix5634 says:

      I know they’ve done that with Amanda Waller and Deadshot, but I really hope that’s not why theyre killing off characters on a large scale. If that’s the case, basically all these dc shows are screwed in the next few years.

    • Skittles&Bits says:

      That doesn’t make sense. By your logic, Grant Gustin’s Flash should be next on DC’s hit list especially since Ezra Miller already brought that very same Flash to the big screen in BvS. If there was such a mandate, the CW Flash couldn’t continue and there goes a cash cow for DCCU.

      • Unknown says:

        I actually agree with you but if they wanted to they could do because it’s called the flash and Wally west does become the flash also so although I do agree with you if they wanted to they could cause they Wally west but that’s a big If and they aren’t that stupid

      • kath says:

        I think they might have done it if Barry Allen weren’t necessary for their biggest TV show.
        It’s no secret that DC nixed Harley Quinn for Arrow and had Deadshot and Waller killed because they’re in the Suicide Squad film.

      • Phoenix5634 says:

        Maybe appearing in a dream sequence in the movie isn’t enough to make them do it yet….I’ve been worrying that they will make Wally the Flash on the tv show when Ezra makes his Flash movie in a year or two….And that will be a huge F you to Grant Gustins fans. If they’re honestly going to do that, it’ll kill off all the DC shows, fans will be pissed if characters start dying randomly as the movies comes out.

      • peterwdawson says:

        Nah, it makes sense if you consider how Justice League worked: first two seasons, plenty of Batman villains (Joker appeared a couple of times no less). Come Unlimited, when the so-called ‘Bat-Embargo’ was in place, it was effectively just Batman, period. They couldn’t pull Batman out since he was a key part of the show. It’s the same now with the Flash: You can’t kill off or write out the Flash of his own damn show, so they’ll live with that, but they don’t want 2 Amanda Wallers, 2 Deadshots, etc.

  18. Phoenix5634 says:

    I really wish fans wouldn’t freak out and stop watching over things like this… Like cmon really, your really mad cuz of the Felicity drama and your using this as an “out”. If this happen and fans weren’t already rallied up, we would be patient then, and expect this to just be a twist in the story.

    • Annie says:

      I’m actually a big Olicity shipper but I also adore Laurel. Fans can be both. I’m done with the show now because Laurel was such an integral character for me and I could connect with her.

      • Phoenix5634 says:

        I get where your coming from, but how do you know this is the end for her? This could just be a twist in the story, like Sara, Thea, Oliver and so on. Be patient, I doubt they’re going to just let her die, Sara isn’t even back from Legends mission. Imagine how she’ll react. And there’s an E2 version as well coming to the series on flash, we don’t know their plans for that.

        • Phoenix5634 says:

          Plus we don’t know fully what Darhk’s Idol is capable of, it can take life energy, maybe it can also give? And the stuff Damien was saying about life forces while he was still in prison and they were getting him the idol.

          Then there’s Barry who shows up to the grave, he could theoretically save her as well. There’s at least like 4-5 way she could be saved. This might not be the end for her.

  19. Arrowhater says:

    Love the message Guggenheim sends to young fans, if you’re a female superhero on Arrow you’ll probably die. Great life lessons for women

  20. jaxr127 says:

    How do you kill the Black Canary on a show about the Green Arrow?

  21. Dj says:

    I disliked Laurel and wanted her gone since season one she was the worst character on the show with Felicity being a close second, but I’m not a fan of how she went out because if this wasn’t about Felicity why have Laurel make this grand dying declaration about Felicity being the love of Oliver’s life and how he needs to find his way back to her. Writing for Olicity shippers is why Felicity has been awful the last two seasons.

    Also didn’t Vixen smash the idol. Why put it back together, why not scatter the pieces everywhere.

    • John NYC says:

      “Also didn’t Vixen smash the idol. Why put it back together, why not scatter the pieces everywhere.”

      Because it was a fun little craft project to while away down time in the bunker and since it’s SO secure NO ONE EVER can break in what would be the harm? Plus in it’s UNLOCKED shiny case it made a nice tchotchke for the space, balanced all the techie-techie…





  22. MLO says:

    She’s not dead. Well, she’s dead, but she’s not gone. Before she died, she leaned into Oliver and asked him to kill her so she could be resurrected through the Lazarus pit. That gives her the bloodlust and will allow her to defeat Darhk. Sooooo formulaic.

    Didn’t anyone find it weird that she was perfectly fine, she’s asked Oliver for a favor and then she died? And Oliver didn’t cry?

    • Julian says:

      I believe Nyssa destroyed the pit after Sara was resurrected

      • Phoenix5634 says:

        Sara was within feet of an active Lazarus pit last episode of Legends.

        • kath says:

          That episode was set in 1960. In 2016, the Pit is gone.

          • Phoenix5634 says:

            Sara is going to return tho, and how do you think se will react? Rip is doing this whole mission to save his family. I bet he’ll let Sara save Laurel. All it would take is one more trip back between 1960 and 2016, plus after last episode we learned Ra’s already knew Sara in 1960.

  23. 134sc says:

    Wow the comment about the courtroom scenes is exactly how I feel about them. Good to know TPTB are aware they aren’t very good

  24. KK says:

    For real life reasons I have fallen several episodes behind on Arrow. I waver every time I think about catching up because I haven’t really loved anything this season. One of the aspects I did like was Laurel standing on her own and up to Oliver. I understood people’s concerns about Laurel at the beginning of Arrow. But I thought the character had a real turning point when she became the Black Canary. I think it’s awful to kill off one of the few strong females on this show and on this network. This is going to be the final straw for me: I’m giving up Arrow. Thank you for making the decision on catching up easy for me.

    • Lauren says:

      This. I liked Laurel so much more as she stood on her own and became Arrow’s teammate and partner. I liked what her character brought to the team. She wasn’t perfect. She was written with imperfections, but that made her a good balance for Oliver and Diggle.

  25. Julian says:

    And now I’m done with this show. You can’t have Green Arrow without Black Canary. The writers have completely destroy this show, and Oliver & Felicity as characters in order to keep the Olicity drama. And don’t get me wrong I like Felicity only not when she’s with Oliver.

    • hank ronson says:

      i don’t think its the writers. I think its the dc film divison. think about it no huntress no black canary I think they are locking the characters off look at what they have done. No waller eather. They go on about separate universes and then they stop them from using characters. The film division is trying to kill this show.

    • Amit says:

      I disagree. You absolutely CAN have Green Arrow without Black Canary. Their legacies, their origins, are not tied together. It’s not like doing Superman without Lois Lane. The fact that Canary was shoehorned into Arrow is part of why she was so terribly written – everything that was great about her in the comics was sacrificed to make her the love interest, and even that was taken from her once Felicity entered the scene.

      • BrianR says:

        You do know that they are married in the comics. Right?.

        • Julieann says:

          You do know on one Green Arrow Comic era that they are divorced and another they never even met. Black Canary is not apart of that Green Arrow. There is several different versions and eras of the Green Arrow. Now I grew up with the ones that she was married and fighting crime with him, but they also had a different background than the TV version

          • Amit says:

            They didn’t get married until the last few years. During the Satellite Era and during Longbow Hunters they were together, but not married.

          • Julieann says:

            I could have sworn that they were married during that time. I’ll have to get them out and reread them

          • Julieann says:

            I could have sworn that they were married during that time. I’ll have to get them out and reread them.

          • Amit says:

            No, that’s why it was such a big deal when they finally tied the knot. Creators were going on about how Ollie was “finally making an honest woman” out of Dinah and stuff. You had characters on-panel going “About time!” when they got the wedding invites and everything. They were in a committed, long-term relationship. But they weren’t married until recently.

          • kath says:

            It’s 2016. I cringe at the idea of “making an honest woman of her” as if the Black Canary is just so much chattel.

          • Amit says:

            Oh, I HATED that line myself.

  26. jrex says:

    Now I have to wonder which actors they don’t like that haven’t been killed off.

  27. John says:

    This put the nail in the coffin for me so to speak. I am so glad I can offically say I am DONE with this piece of &&%$ teen beat peace of crap show. Arrow is nothing but a show for 13 yr old girls. And F*** Olicity. Destroy this show.

    • Phoenix5634 says:

      Give next season a chance, and the last few episodes this season. I think the showrunners have learnt their lesson for turning Arrow into soap opera since the crossover this season. I have good hopes for next season.

  28. Phoenix5634 says:

    Although I already miss Laurel, this was an A+ episode. It felt more like the Arrow I’ve missed this season. If it weren’t for Laurels death I’d call this episode awesome, but it’s hard to any episode “awesome” when a beloved character dies. But the acting was amazing, and the team dynamics were spot on.

  29. Dj says:

    I am looking forward to Madison McLaughlin. She was great on supernatural having her on the show in a recurring role would do nothing, but help improve it. Note to CW please do a Wayward daughters spin-off and put Krissy in it.

    • Isobel says:

      Agree I’d add Krissy and the donut eating female cop Donna to the team including Jody and her daughters.

  30. QueenB says:

    I hate that they killed her off I loved Laurel and I think Katie is an amazing actress the writing for her was weak and honestly Katie and the character deserved better

  31. kath says:

    I was never a Laurel fan but I wanted a more heroic death for her. Basically she died because of Quentin (fridging!) and not because of being a superhero.

    I like that Laurel got a number of hero moments, I liked that Thea fought Malcolm but couldn’t defeat him, and I thought David Ramsey was great as he stood up to Oliver with his belief in Andy and then broke when Andy betrayed them.

    I wish Laurel had not given Oliver and Felicity her blessing and then said that Oliver was the love of her life. (What about Tommy????) Olicity is strong enough to stand on its own without that and this is just going to fan the Felicity hate even more.

  32. Morgan says:

    Tonight’s episode was a perfect example of how lazy and melodramatic Arrow’s writers have become. For 40 minutes, I waited for the plot twist, the moment when the writers show you they are actually trying to do a good job… Alas, no. It was obvious Laurel will die from 3 min in… And that’s all. The characters made stupid decisions. The idol came back into play out of thin air. Laurel died. Talking about Oliver and Felicity on her dead bed. I mean… I love Felicity, but this was ridiculous. They made Laurel’s last words be about Olicity. Geez.

    • tvjunkie says:

      Well they had to pander to the soap opera crowd and the teenage girls.

      • Phoenix5634 says:

        It’s ironic how “fan service” always kicks in around season 3-4. Every show, even the big network ones like GoT and TWD. And fan service usually ruin shows eventually.

  33. stanmakiewicz says:

    Long time comic fan. No Black Canary makes a poor Arrow- that’s been a, what, 30 year journey in the mythos. What, that’s not a long enough time span to go through so many moments and explore? And already a history there- missed opportunity.
    I enjoyed the show for the past 4-ish seasons, but enough of pushing Felicity down our throats.
    Laurel, though rushed as Black Canary, was fine in the role, a team member until the end. I’m disappointed on Laurel, and Katie, as Black Canary, no longer (at this time) being on the show, and Arrow now has this one less viewer – yes I know there are 1.2 million more of your out there but it’s my time and comment, so shush.
    Feel free writers to continue to pander to the “shippers”, I will continue to enjoy other shows such as Supernatural and the 100 on CW- just not Arrow. Wish I could do Flash, but I never cared for the alternate-Earth stories in any media.

  34. QueenB says:

    If they add another female to the team especially this season I’m out and his comments about a vocal minority was a slap in the face she was the star of the show she was the first person cast on the series and the female lead and just because some people didn’t like the character or actress it doesn’t mean the character should be killer and they did use her final moments to give Ollie her blessing saying she isn’t the love of his life but he’s love of hers

  35. Nichole says:

    I found a lot of this interview to be insulting. Marc seems really out of touch.

    I’ve hated a lot of how they treated this character. I have love for her, but honestly most of that is for what she could have been and should have been. The writers screwed her up early on because story-wise, they weren’t ready for her to be a full-time character until season 3. She was written really inconsistently in season 1 and they had no idea what to do with her in season 2, hence the filler addiction story.

    The vocal minority comment was really stupid. The fan base seems pretty evenly split. If any group was a “vocal minority” it was the I-hate-Laurel brigade that would turn the comment section of every Arrow-related article into a big fight, even when the article had nothing to do with her.

    The comment about how they told Oliver and Laurel’s love story in season 1 was lame. Uh…no you didn’t. They laid a lot of groundwork for it, but never fully told it. It seemed like that was a multi-season story they were going to tell, but then they changed their minds and said “nevermind” in the season 2 opener.

    Oh, and if you don’t want fans to accuse you of pandering to shippers, then don’t throw crap lines like “Go be with Felicity” in where they make no sense. I’m not a Felicity hater. I used to love her in Season 1, but the show has focused on her way too much the last two years. Oliver often feels like a secondary character these days. I don’t want her written off, but I could definitely do with less.

    I could go on, but this is already too long.

  36. ktc1986 says:

    As a comic book reader i’m infuriated by this development but it was always going to be Laurel who died, can’t exclude those Tumblr fans who keep forgetting this show is based on a guy’s crusade to save his city and not “Olicity” or the CW might be in danger of having a good show on their hands!

    Ironically, the one episode where Felicity and her angst were absent for 95% actually turned out to be one of the better ones of the entire season.

  37. Nancy says:

    After coming out of surgery I thought she was safe and that someone else was going to die. Then she did! I was surprised and I cried, everyone seemed so genuinely sad. I liked her, she will be missed .

  38. What a spit in the face of the character Laurel Lance. In her death bed her last lines pertained to Olicity. If you don’t think shipping has impact on network shows, tonight’s episode is the perfect example. Something that was interesting to note. When Michael Ausiello interviewed the Arrow cast in Comic-Con last summer he said something to the effect of how all the emails he gets from fans of Arrow is about Olicity. This has impact. It impacts how this show is covered on the site, it impacts what questions are asked to the EP’s of the show, and it informs the show runners on what they can and can’t sacrifice. And what they can’t sacrifice is Olicity. Unfortunately the shippers drive this show. Go on twitter right now and see who is rejoicing this new development. Every account that has a picture of Felicity are in jubilation. And what this ultimately means is that the writers of the show cater to that ship. This is a microcosm of all network shows that revolve around couples and shipping. That is why shows like Daredevil will always be better than Arrow. Writers aren’t beholden to shippers on that show. Fans of network shows especially CW shows are the most entitled people you’ll see. They demand stories that follows their whim, yet advertisers are the one that directly help these networks survive. Meanwhile in streaming services like Netflix where viewers directly pay for the service, and in doing so voice their pleasure or displeasure of shows , they even aren’t arrogant enough to dictate to writers how stories should go. And why is that the greatest thing for writers? Because it gives them freedom and they don’t have to cater to anybody. Creatively that’s the best environment you can ask for.

  39. Calli says:

    THat was some amazing television. The performances, the drama, the action (those fight sequences! the stunt choreography this week was UNREAL)… it all really worked well together. It was a fitting tribute. Arrow did a great job.

  40. Drew says:

    I for one am pissed! I love Laurel. I’ll admit I wasn’t loving her at first in 1st season, but she grew on me. I still think Sarah was better looking as Black Canary, but I loved watching her kick but. I thought John Diggle would be in the grave. I’m sad! I don’t know if I’m gonna continue watching Arrow. I’m gonna think about it. I really hope he comes back to life, but not with the pit. New twist please!

  41. Unknown says:

    Although I think she will be back somehow I don’t agree with him when he said they touched on the Ollie laurel relationship ….I have no particular ship but I do remember that she was with tommy majority of the season so to say say you touched on it I think is crap but any way I think she will be back

  42. 88Aladdin says:

    I’m still enjoying this season and the show for that matter. I’m under no illusion that characters are untouchable when it comes to death. As for the whole comic book canon thing, well, the show isn’t the comic so I’ve always been really puzzled when people keep trying to compare the two so I’ll just say good luck to Katie Cassidy and wish her the best post-Arrow.

  43. Celina says:

    I think arrow haven’t been very good in a while. Felicity was a good character when she was secondary and comic relief. Then she became unbearable. They decided to kill all characters that actually exists in the comics. Lame. Ridiculous.

  44. Missy says:

    I’m not buying it. She supposedly dies after asking Oliver for a secret or promise and right after she has been cleared by the Drs. Another lie these lame writers will make Ollie keep from his friends. That recipe is old. Again not buying it. I say she is laying low to save her father from being killed by that psycho Darkh.

  45. Ruben says:

    I hope in one way or another they bring back BlackCanary–Katie Cassidy. She was a staple on the show. Why do they (writers) always when we get used to a character end up killing them off, I guess to keep the show fresh and not get complacent. Really, not Black Canary. She has come a long way! Hopefully we can see her as a regular in another CW show. We should rally together and riot to being Katie back.

  46. John NYC says:

    Lazy way to boost the show.

    Disappointed. NOW the bar is very high: win or your gone.

  47. Shep says:

    Y’all haters are so annoying. Lol

  48. frankbenditt says:

    I did not like her character from the beginning. I also did not think, as an actor, she made me believe in her. It was a terrific decision. Now, the reaction from the crew will be intriguing.

  49. Rob says:

    I was not a fan of this at all. Mostly because they did fail the character from the jump. Season 1 Laurel was not warm to Oliver and she had every right to be. By the end of Season 1, she should’ve found out Ollie’s secret. Instead she became an alcoholic overnight while her much cooler sister came to town. So fine, we get Sara and she’s great. Then she dies all so Laurel can rightfully become the Black Canary. But they rushed it so much that, again, she was an overnight ninja. Finally she’s Black Canary and they kill her. On top of all of that, you have the Olicity business going on when, sorry, he’s supposed to be with the Black Canary. They owed the character much more depth, and they owed the fans the love story between Green Arrow and Black Canary.

    • Rob says:

      Finally, I just want to say that I do hope that this is a fake out and they do bring the Earth-2 Laurel over permanently so they can completely retcon the character. She needs to be bold, strong, and be the MF-ing Black Canary or Siren or whatever the f they want to call her. Just as long as Ollie and she are on the same badass level and we get what Laurel should’ve been from day 1.

  50. Lee says:

    Really bad decision to kill Laurel.