Arrow Season 4 Recap

Arrow Recap: When Buildings Attack — Plus: [Spoiler] Uncovers Oliver's Secret

This Wednesday on Arrow, Damien Darhk’s demolition team huffs and puffs and targets our band of heroes with some carefully orchestrated building deconstruction. Elsewhere, Thea makes a big discovery about Oliver, and then gives her brother some disappointing advice.

The danger kicks off when Lance answers a breaking and entering call. But why the heck is such a simple offense being related to the Police Captain, Laurel wonders. Her instincts are right-on: the whole structure starts to crumble around Lance, but thanks to his daughter’s help, he manages to get out with only a nasty head wound.

H.I.V.E.’s new hired goons aren’t done yet, though. Felicity tracks the call’s origin to a factory, where Team Arrow gets ensnared in another demolition. As they run out, Thea grabs a laptop containing blueprints and escapes through a window. Oliver asks Felicity to mine the damaged device for the next target, prompting her to note it’s “kind of romantic” how the request echoes their first meeting. She, in turn, tasks Curtis with uncovering the data, which points to the location of the mayoral debate. But wouldn’t Darhk kill his own wife in the process? Oliver surmises that Ruvé wouldn’t be harmed — and instead come out the sympathetic survivor of such an attack.

Arrow Season 4 RecapFelicity sets about hacking the fire-alarm system in order to evacuate the building, but Thea brings out an old high school trick by just pulling the alarm. (Nice one, little Queen, but it doesn’t make up for the lying exchange I’ll get to later.) The team thwarts the demolition and Oliver comes out the clear winner in the debate – “That’s nice applause. Enough to bring the house down. Almost,” he whispers to Ruvé – but his troubles are far from over. At the close of the hour, Darhk introduces his daughter to Oliver’s son William, who will be staying with them. (And the preview for next week suggests it isn’t a voluntary stay, as Darhk declares he kidnapped William.)

Now onto the Lying Is a Queen’s Sport portion of the episode. After finding out the truth about William, Thea basically gives her brother permission to keep lying to his fiancée, even as he expresses guilt over it. As far as Thea sees it, he’s keeping a promise to the mother of his child and maintaining William’s safety. “Thank you for saying what I needed to hear” to justify my totally bad behavior, Oliver responds.

Lance does a bit of lying to his loved one, as well, in order to protect Donna. However, she has a finely tuned BS detector and doesn’t buy his story about owing money to some bad men. Rather than taking some time apart, she suggests they call off their Arrow Season 4 Recaprelationship. Donna is heartbroken, confiding in Felicity that the reason she’s been going overboard on her and Oliver’s engagement party – glitter bomb invitations! Pin the Junk on the Hunk! – is because she’s living vicariously through her. “You [and Oliver] don’t lie to each other,” she tells her daughter. “I’m never going to find a love like that.” Felicity suggests that maybe she should return Lance’s love with a little trust. At the soiree, the Captain finally confesses that he was working with H.I.V.E. (to protect Laurel), and the two kiss and makeup.

Meanwhile, Curtis gives Felicity the best engagement gift ever: an implantable bio-stimulant that will one day help her walk down the aisle – if there even is a wedding.

In flashbacks, we learn Reiter believes Oliver has been bestowed passage to some hidden place that houses a powerful object. So he needs to keep him alive, but there are many various forms of alive, Reiter notes. And Oliver finally kills Conklin, praise be!

Arrow fans, what did you think of the explosive episode? Was Thea in the right or wrong? Hit the comments with your thoughts!

Comments are monitored, so don’t go off topic, don’t frakkin’ curse and don’t bore us with how much your coworker’s sister-in-law makes per hour. Talk smart about TV!

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123 Comments
  1. amb1973 says:

    I’d love to know why they are intentionally ruining their protagonist. Dude’s so dumb I don’t know how he doesn’t drown in the shower.

  2. Janine says:

    I’m glad you dragged Thea for her terrible, terrible advice. Not only is the lie not keeping William safe at all, but it was completely out of character for Thea to have that point of view. Thea, who spent three years complaining that everyone was lying to her – and who went ballastic upon finally learning the truth about her own paternity. Be better, show!

    Between the way they’re having to twist characters to justify Oliver’s behaviour and the ridiculously dumb amount of foreshadowing, I can’t wait until the lie is out in the open and we can start moving past this madness. At least we have Curtis. He’s terrific.

    • amb1973 says:

      You mean that you don’t buy that Felicity knowing would endanger the kid, when Oliver the Idiot wasn’t at all concerned about Malcolm Merlyn, a known supervillain, knowing? Say it ain’t so!

      Not sure who’s dumber, Oliver, Thea, or the writers.

      • fanta says:

        The writers.

        • niloofar22 says:

          Samantha’s logic is so stupid, Oliver going along with it is stupider. how the hell is she going to stop him from seeing his son if he tells anyone? the stupidest part of her logic is not telling their son about his father, the kid isn’t even curious about his dad.😅

          • Olivia says:

            The kid isn’t curious about much. Random man coming to visit him with no explanation (Oliver) and going on a playdate to the strange creepy supervillian’s house…in another city with a big smile on his face. Where the heck is his mom?

          • amb1973 says:

            He is his daddy’s son, after all.

      • Gail says:

        Also why did Malcolm Merlyn tell Ollie he knew about his son, William? Ollie would have no clue how Damien Darhk found out about his son if Malcolm kept his mouth shut to Ollie. I expected and was disappointed that Darhk’s wife didn’t bring up that Ollie had a son at the debate. I though that would be the big OMG moment with Felicity finding out as the episode ends. Only one more episode before the show is off for several weeks.

      • kath says:

        The writers, because they forgot that in season 2, Thea was so angry at Moira and Oliver for lying to her about her paternity, she went of with killer of 504+ people Malcolm Merlyn.

        If anyone should have given Oliver hell for lying about having a child, it’s thea.

    • sue says:

      Ugh, yes to all of this. It’s like the writers never watched their own show! Thea was the last person who would ever give Oliver that advice. This whole plotline has been a big, soap opera mess.

      • Sil says:

        Thank you everybody. Strong, logical, truth talking. The writers have dipped to low level of ignorant to expect the viewers to accept this stupid storyline. Thea was the wrong person for them to use as their mouth piece to convince Oliver about the lie as logical. Bogus. Next week it comes out. The stupid of it all is that Oliver knows that Malcolm knows, Malcolm is not to ever be trusted, and Oliver doesn’t tell the person he trusts the most? Biggest nonsense of a plot point to move a story along. Makes Oliver look ignorant. Sigh! The show look bad.

      • Rob Watkins says:

        Thea lied to Oliver about Malcolm, so it’s not unprecedented.

        • Sil says:

          After he’d lied to her about Malcolm being her dad, she didn’t trust him to tell him about where she was going. Ironic that she chose Malcolm. Sinister, muderer.

    • fanta says:

      On the one hand, I’m glad it wasn’t Diggle who gave him the dumb advice for selfish reasons (being that I adore Diggle)…but on the other, Thea was the worst person, given what we’ve been seen so far, to tell Oliver it was okay to lie–that he had to do it–considering her own history. I hate to say it, but if there’s one person who should have advocated for lying, it should have been Laurel, who lied to her father for months to protect him from his youngest daughter being dead. So dumb, show. So dumb. This storyline just keeps getting more and more awful.

      • amb1973 says:

        I’m very glad it wasn’t Diggle or Donna. I want them both to destroy Oliver, and now Thea, about this. I mean, I want Felicity to destroy him, but I want them to provide a major assist.

        I don’t know how I’m supposed to believe Oliver loves Felicity anymore. I did in S3, but he treats her like crap now. Never there for her, constantly chooses Thea over her, lies to her face. Great job ruining Olicity for at least some former fans, Guggie! You can have him, Laurel. Bring on a very well-cast Richard Grayson for Felicity’s permanent new love interest.

    • Michelle says:

      How dare Thea be mature and see the bigger picture! What a horrible human being!

      • amb1973 says:

        How, exactly, would Felicity knowing hurt the kid? Is she secretly really really EVOL? If she is so untrustworthy, why would Oliver want to MARRY HER?

      • Liz says:

        She’s not exactly seeing the bigger picture when William is no safer with Felicity not knowing his existence. The kid gets taken. That proves the need for the lie is pointless.

      • Janine says:

        What’s the bigger picture? Honestly, I’d love to know. None of the justifications mentioned on the show make sense to me. so please tell me what I’m missing. Because from my POV, this entire series has been about Oliver learning to let people in and trust his team. And the whole ‘lying to keep you safe’ trope was overcome when he decided to move forward with Felicity. (Lance made a similar decision tonight, and it felt like growth, not poor decision making.) So how does Thea supporting the lie forward anyone’s arc or character development? I’m genuinely curious.

      • Bwhit says:

        How well does that logic work based on the end of the episode and the promo? Perhaps if Oliver had told Felicity or anyone they would not have to go on defense next week on how to get the kid no one knew about back.

      • Gail says:

        What makes no sense is why the mother would tell Ollie that he can’t tell anyone that he has a child. It creates all this false drama. Her threat doesn’t even have teeth. Ollie could take her to court for access to his son He has DNA proof that he is the father or he can get it if Barry’s going back in time changed that.

        • Dj says:

          I understand why the mom did what she did. The Oliver she knew wasnt a great guy and is from a family who tried to buy her off and make her disappear. She wouldnt want her son near them. Even if it looks like Oliver has changed how can she be sure. He has to earn her trust.

      • JC1 says:

        What exactly is the bigger picture, pray tell? That the writers needed a plot contrivance to drive Oliver and Felicity apart for a few episodes and create draaaama? Malcolm Merlyn knows!! If Oliver had a brain in his head, or if the writers were not so determined to make their hero look as stupid as possible, he would have realized that the cat is out of the bag, and begin taking steps to keep William safe, which would include bringing Felicity into the loop. There is no reasonable logic in the world that says that oh, one of my two worst enemies knows about my son, but the woman I love absolutely cannot know, for his safety!! *facepalm* TVLine should do a poll – which was the worst plot contrivance in a drama this year? Beckett’s lie to Castle, or Oliver’s lie to Felicity?

      • Josh says:

        So it’s okay that POS Malcolm knows about the kid but not the woman he plans to marry and you forget that Willam was kidnapped in the end of the episode. Oliver should’ve told everyone about the freaking kid when Malcolm revealed that he knew. Yes it’s perfectly normal to bend over backwards for a B#### who hid his kid from him. HE HAS RIGHTS to see his kid Screw the insane demands of a horrid woman

    • Rob Watkins says:

      It’s not like she didn’t lie before. Remember when she lied about being with Malcolm?

    • 134sc says:

      Honestly i think it was great advice from a sister to a brother. At the end of the day, Thea will always be on Ollie’s side. That is the perspective she is coming from, so in that regard, the advice was perfectly reasonable.

      I dunno, as an older brother with a younger sister, it resonated with me.

      • KL says:


        How exactly is this a “great”, “perfectly reasonable” advice ? In my opinion, a good advice = helping someone make the right decision. Thea did the exact opposite because seriously, not telling Felicity about William is one of the stupidest things Oliver has ever done. Sure, it was a nice moment between brother and sister because Thea showed understanding, acceptance and support. But she told Oliver what he wanted to hear, not what he needed to hear. Thea provided momentary comfort, not real help.

        First, telling Felicity about William wouldn’t be a threat in any way. She has proven countless times that she can keep secrets and is ready to risk her life to help Oliver. She has supported him through the worst moments of his life, she at least deserves some honesty… Moreover, as the tech genius she is, she could have easily kept an eye on William for his safety without anyone noticing. So on the contrary, telling her (AND the other members of the team) would have been the safest choice. And Samantha would have had no way to know that Oliver did reveal his son’s existence. So yeah, this secret is perfectly useless. Hiding William from the eyes of the “world/society” makes sense. Hiding him from team Arrow don’t. It’s just a bad choice.

        Besides, not telling Felicity at this point is completely hypocritical. Malcolm Merlyn can know and it’s fine (even though he clearly threatened Oliver and is known as a dangerous psycho), Thea can know as well and it’s ok, but Felicity must never learn of this ? What on earth is that logic ? Once again, not only has she proven herself, she’s supposed to be Oliver’s soulmate and soon-to-be wife, someone he can trust and rely on blindly. She loves him and she believes in him, and how does he repay her ? He keeps secrets and lies to her face, pushing her away from a whole part of his life, a significant one. William is family to Oliver, but Felicity is supposed to be too, Hiding William’s existence from her is just unfair. And this kind of lie has always ended up blowing in Oliver’s face, so he should have learned his lesson by now. He’s not protecting William, he’s not protecting Felicity either, he’s just being stubborn.

        Lastly Thea is just in the worst position to give such an advice to Oliver. She knows first hand how destructive these kinds of secrets are since she suffered from them so much (remember how angry she was with Oliver and her mom when she discovered the truth about her father). She wants people to be honest with her, but she encourages her brother to lie ? Well if that isn’t hypocritical I don’t know what is. Anyway, it’s not her place to tell what Felicity should or should not know, simply because (beware, I’m going to state the obvious here) a brother/sister relationship is NOT the same as a husband/wife relationship. When Felicity learn about this, she’s bound to feel betrayed, maybe even rejected in a way Thea wouldn’t.

        So yeah, cute broXsis moment but WORST ADVICE EVER (well maybe not ever but pretty close).

  3. Roger says:

    I don’t have a problem with Thea telling Oliver that to hold up to his pact with Samantha. He’s running for Mayor, his engagement is public knowledge. Any deviation to that relationship would have let Samantha known that Oliver told Felicity. He knows it sucks, but wants to be part of William’s life.

    Thea hated people lying to her but that was before she was she found out that Oliver and Roy were The Arrow and Arsenal and before becoming part of Team Arrow.

    Interesting to see where the flashbacks ultimately lead to as throughout the entire series they’ve always been.

    • Carla Krae says:

      Agreed. This situation isn’t the same as what Thea had before.

      • amb1973 says:

        Thea was enraged about Oliver and Moira not telling her Malcolm was her father long before she found out the Arrow stuff. She was ENRAGED that they lied to her about a personal issue she had every right to know. It is exactly the same.

        • Roger says:

          But she wasn’t part of Team Arrow. It’s always easy to be outraged when you’re on the outside. Not when you’re on the inside. She’s been lying to Alex this whole season. It’s not out of character for her. She’s adapting to her situation.

          • amb1973 says:

            Being lied to about who her father is had nothing to do with Team Arrow. Everyone gets a pass for lying about Team Arrow. Oliver being a Baby Daddy has nothing to do with Team Arrow. THAT is why it is exactly the same.

        • Carla Krae says:

          It’s not the same at all.

        • 134sc says:

          No it’s not, only because an argument can be made that Felicity has no right to know. Right or wrong, the argument is plausable. On the other hand, Malcom is Thea’s father, so she has every right to know

          • GirlvsTV says:

            How does Felicity not have a right to know Oliver has a kid and that he’s been lying to her about it?! She’s going to MARRY him, if anything she has more of right to know than Thea – or really anyone else on the show apart from Oliver.

          • amb1973 says:

            Are you literally insane? She is going to MARRY him. She has EVERY RIGHT to know that by marrying this moron she’d be a STEPMOM.

          • JC1 says:

            It actually is not plausible. Sure, the argument can be made, and has been. But there is no plausible argument that the woman he is going to marry does not have the right to know about this.

          • kath says:

            While an argument maybe could be made if Oliver never wanted to see the kid again and Felicity would only find out about him as she was executing Oliver’s will, Oliver has made it very clean that he wants to be a part of William’s life and this is definitely going to affect his wife, Felicity.

            At the least, she’s going to notice if he keeps inventing excuses to go to CentrlLCity.

    • amb1973 says:

      Bc Felicity, of all people, can’t keep a secret?

      There’s no possible way for Samantha to know if Oliver told Felicity unless she has Oliver bugged. Not to mention, MALCOLM MERLYN knows.

      There’s no defending this storyline. It’s absolutely idiotic.

      • Roger says:

        Wrong, he’s a public figure. Even Central City has been covering his campaign as featured in many Flash episodes.

        • amb1973 says:

          What does him being a public figure have to do with it? Do you think Felicity is going to make a public announcement? Felicity has kept all his secrets for going on four years now. He doesn’t have to announce it to the world, derr. He just should have told the woman he’s asked, multiple times, to marry him, that HE HAS A FRIGGING KID.

          This is not rocket science.

        • Bwhit says:

          I’m confused at your point. Are you saying if Oliver and Felicity were to end their engagement, Samantha would assume it was because he told her about William?

          • amb1973 says:

            The point is that Thea should not support him lying to Felicity, because he never had to lie to Felicity. If he had told her the minute they got back from Central City, Nasty hagbag baby mama could not possibly have known that he told Felicity, bc Felicity can, as we know, keep a secret. Therefore, he did not have to keep his pact and lie to Felicity. He NEVER had to lie to Felicity.

            If your point is that telling Felicity would result in her dumping him which would alert Hagbag Baby Mama that he’d spilled the beans, and that’s why Thea supported the lie, that is not what she said. Not to mention, Hagbag Baby Mama wouldn’t have any way of knowing WHY Felicity dumped him. As we know, Hagbag Baby Mama doesn’t think much of Oliver. I’m sure she’d have plenty of other thoughts about why someone would dump him. I mean, since she got knocked up bc she was ‘hoing around with him, I’d guess that cheating would be her first guess.

          • Bwhit says:

            No I was responding to Roger. I think that Samantha is the worst since she was introduced and is a terrible person using her son to strong arm Oliver as a gotcha. Thea’s advice was ridiculous and just played into Oliver’s already horrible rationalization of this whole situation. Felicity has kept every secret from day one and I think this storyline is terrible.

    • bbussey says:

      Agreed. This secrecy situation is totally different than the previous ones. First off, it’s Samantha that is insisting on the secrecy, not Oliver, and she’s holding Oliver’s visitation rights as the ransom. I don’t fault Oliver or Thea on this one.

      • GirlvsTV says:

        Except she doesn’t have all the power here. Oliver could go through the court system to attain visitation rights and there would be no reason for him to lie to anyone about it. And how would she even know if he told Felicity anyway?

        • Olivia says:

          Exactly. She keeps his secrets, and Oliver knows that. It’s up to him to know that about Felicity– and I honestly, think the character does know this. This storyline is being played through all sorts of character deviation. I also don’t like how they show him starting to feel guilt and wanting to tell Felicity, but the writers just shut it down for drama sake… At the very least, I’d rather him tell her late because he wants to not after he’s caught and has to. This whole story is ridiculously contrived. I guess we’ll just have to get through it. Boo.

        • amb1973 says:

          Don’t you know, Baby Mama is apparently telepathic. Or has Oliver bugged. Maybe that’s why he’s so dumb now…the bug is in his brain and it’s causing his brain to liquefy.
          Or wait, BABY MAMA WOULD NEVER HAVE KNOWN IF HE’D TOLD FELICITY. Not to mention, quite a few courts wouldn’t just grant Oliver visitation, he’d likely get full physical custody. Family courts aren’t big fans of nasty hagbags who lie about the very existence of other people’s children for TEN YEARS.

          • Dj says:

            Dont think Oliver would win full custody. Oliver was thought to be dead for 5 years and all Sam has to say was she waa scared of Moria who tried to pay her off and who after Oliver did return was put on trial in connection with the deaths of 500. Then she can easily bring up how being with Oliver could put her son in danger as the public knows about Moria getting murdered and Oliver family being kidnapped and his limo being shot up.

          • amb1973 says:

            He’s in danger because Oliver is his father, regardless of where or with whom he lives. That is an unchangeable fact. Indeed, the idiot kid is safer with Oliver, bc Oliver and Felicity can provide more protection. Moira’s attempt to pay her off, which did not include any physical threats, have zero to do with Oliver and would not be held against him, particularly as she is now DEAD and would have no effect on the child’s upbringing. Oliver’s sojourn on a deserted island is not a bad act of his own. Family court judges do not look kindly on people who hide the actual existence of other people’s children, and in the United States, BOTH parents have a right to parent, which the lying hag robbed him of for ten years.
            Regardless, he would DEFINITELY get generous visitation and 50% of legal custody, meaning the right to make decisions regarding the child’s upbringing.

          • Dj says:

            He would get some rights. But a judge is going to consider what Moria did and how Sam was scared of her as to why she lied. Yeah he wouldnt like what she did, and Oliver would get some custody rights but not full like someone else said. Her lying doesnt make her an unfit mother it makes her a crappy human, but William has been happy, healthy, cared for and protected. To get full he needs to prove she is unfit and it would be easier for her lawyers to prove what a danger Oliver lifestyle is then his to prove she shoudnt have custody.

          • kath says:

            I don’t think Oliver would want full custody of William. But what he does want is to be a part of William’s life and have his son know him, which would also be good for william himself. I can’t imagine any court would refuse Oliver access to William so Samantha was manipulating and playing on Oliver being a good guy, which is the opposite of the reason she gave him refusing to let him see William.

            Damien Darhk probably told William he was Mommy’s friend so William thought it was okay to go with him. Because it’s okay to spend time alone with Mommy’s friend in your bedroom,.

            There is NO EXCUSE for Samantha’s behaviour and very little for Oliver’s, which makes this the STUPIDEST plotline of the show ever.

          • Dj says:

            You are right about Oliver and he wouldnt want full custody. He isnt that type of person to do that. As for Sam her demands are overprotective and plot induce stupidity. At the very most she should have said you can visit and prove you have changed so he could gain the trust of William and Sam then work from there.

          • kath says:

            Plot-induced stupidity indeed.
            I know the writers want to break them up this season; I just wish they had written the story more logically.

        • bbussey says:

          There’s a child’s interest in the mix as well, a child who doesn’t know Oliver is his father and has no emotional investment in that relationship. Any legal action against Samantha, the only parent he’s known, will have significant effect on William. It would seem that Oliver has taken that into account.

          Very difficult to put the blame on Oliver regarding this issue. He’s between a rock and a hard place, and the well being of the child is the top priority.

          • amb1973 says:

            He is NOT bw a rock and a hard place, bc if he had told Felicity on Day 1, SHE NEVER WOULD HAVE TOLD ANYONE ELSE. Have you completely failed to notice that Felicity CAN KEEP A SECRET.
            Btw, fathers have exactly as much right to their kids as mothers do, legally, ethically, and morally. In fact, since this particular mother is a lying ho, quite a few family court judges would grant OLIVER physical custody. AND Oliver’s visiting on the regular, which any normal kid would be pretty weirded out by “Mom, why does this random man keep coming by to play with me, alone, in my bedroom?”

    • Josh says:

      She had no right to demand that of him and if Oliver had told Felicity to keep quiet she wouldve had done it. Felicity would not tell the world and she wouldn’t have broke up with him over having a child but she will cause he lied for months

      • Kira says:

        I agree Felicity would not have cared that Oliver has fathered a child before he met her, and I think that she would be more likely to encourage Oliver to have a relationship with his son seeing as how she knows what it’s like to grow up with out a father. But him lying to her will not fly especially since they are supposed to be on the whole “no keeping secrets” thing.

    • kath says:

      Thea hated that her family lied to her about who her father is, but now she’s telling Oliver to do that very thing?

      How would Samantha have known if Oliver told Felicity? All he had to do was tell her about the boy and say it had to be kept secret or Samantha wouldn’t let him see William. Felicity is good at keeping secrets. She could also help protect William from Damian Darhk.

      Not to mention, why is Samantha still letting him see William now that she knows that Oliver was attacked while riding in limo with his fiance and she’s paralyzed? It’s one thing to want to keep the boy away from Oliver because he was a douche 11 years ago (although unfair IMO); it’s quite another to let him keep seeing William now that she knows he is being targeted by very violent men who could kill Oliver and William. What kind of a mother is she?

      This is the stupidest reason for a storyline the show has ever done, and that saying something given the Malcolm/Ra’s plot last season.

  4. Bwhit says:

    I would say that Thea told Oliver what he WANTED to hear not what he NEEDED to hear. This is my least favorite storyline this year and it looks to be coming to a head next week. I love Curtis, he’s the best!

  5. Jobless says:

    I miss when this show was good. It’s becoming more and more of a chore to sit through every week.

  6. herman1959 says:

    Soooo, again we can ask: Who is in the grave? I think that based on tonight, it’s a tie between Quentin Lance and Samantha (William’s mom).

    • amb1973 says:

      At this point I’m hoping for a lot of bodies stuffed into that one grave.

    • Michelle says:

      Probably Felicity. Oliver is hallucinating Felicity in the car.

    • Chris Coburn says:

      Well, it could also be Donna or William. Either would be a cause for Felicity’s reaction in the Limo at the cemetery: Donna, for obvious reasons, and William because he’s a child {And part of Oliver.} Lance fits as well, since his death would affect Donna, but I don’t see Felicity being angry that Oliver’s baby mama has died.

      And also? Who is the “him” Ollie is planning to kill? Yes, everyone has thought up to now that it was Darhk, but if it’s actually William in the grave, maybe the “him” is Merlyn instead.

    • btm says:

      Hopefully, it’s the Olicity ‘ship, and for good this time. My actual guess is Lance too, though. None of Oliver, Barry or Felicity are in pieces, so none of William, Thea, or Donna quite make sense. Possibly Diggle, as his death could leave everyone composed but determined as well. I don’t think they’d kill off two Canaries.

      For me, I always figured that the endgame core relationship for this show was going to be canon, e.g Black Canary. Felicity became a fan favorite early on, and they decided to milk that ‘ship for 20-30 episodes as part of the hero’s journey. A sunny break between cloudy patches.

      I’d favor the series going darker again, when I think it was at its crackling best in terms of tension, stakes, atmosphere, etc. A regression in terms of the main character’s progress into a fully functioning member of society, triggered by a death and the end of his engagement, would probably do the trick. Introduce setbacks in terms of Green Arrow keeping his rage in check when fighting bad guys. Teetering and going over the edge was a better tone for this show.

  7. Liz says:

    I’m glad you thought it was bad for Thea to advocate Oliver’s lie. It felt like they were using Thea to validate their terrible story choices. Thea has always hated lying, it’s been her thing since she was repeatedly lied to over the years. So for her to change her time like this felt incredibly out of character. Also Thea now knows, after Malcolm, so why can’t Felicity know too? There’s no secret anymore. Ridiculous and contrived storytelling. This show is going so bad at this.

  8. KD says:

    Even though I’m not thrilled with lie, mainly because its such a uncharacteristic and cliche soap opera trope, I can justify him lying about this. People who are close to Oliver Queen, not the Green Arrow, have a habit of getting hurt or dying because of him. Sara was died three times in relation to Oliver, Moira was killed because Slade wanted revenge for Shado who was also killed to punish Oliver in a way, Thea almost died cause Ras wanted to teach Oliver a lesson, and Felicity was targeted because of how much she mean’s to Oliver. So looking at it from Oliver’s perception, especially considering Felicity was just recently hurt, I could see him saying that it’s better if I don’t say anything. But at least you can see this is eating away at him. It’s not like he’s being malicious or purposely trying to hurt Felicity. He’s trying not to lose his son or the woman he loves, and his actions reflect his desperation in trying to keep both in his life. Not saying he’s right in what he’s doing, but it’s understandable.

    • SuzyQue says:

      We’ll see. I think you may be right and it will be understandable IF he hasn’t been visiting his child this whole time. But if he knows Darkh is targeting those around him and is still in contact with William, and if he didn’t do anything to warn Samantha that one of his enemies found out about their son, than the justification that he isn’t saying anything to keep him safe goes out the window. We’ll see next week, I guess.

    • Maria says:

      If that’s the case then he should be staying away from William too. 3epsides ago he mentioned that he has been going back and forth to Central City. Assuming it’s not to see Barry because there haven’t been crossovers, it’s been to see William. Being Oliver Queen with a target on your back should make you say Hey. I should stay away until Darkh is taken care of. Oh no wait. I’ll just not tell anyone and still visit my son. What kind of logic is that. I also assume Samantha watched the news. Would t she see that Oliver’s fiancé was shot while riding in a car with him. What kind of mom does that make her if she is letting him come visit and by extension putting her son in danger? No the Secret is the dumbest part of this whole BM drama. It is unnecessary. Also let me point out that she kept the kids existence from Oliver. He had no clue. He has rights. She took the money and ran. He also has the money and the power to keep William.
      So lie is just for dramas sake.

    • amb1973 says:

      He did not say one single word about being afraid of losing Felicity. It was all about honoring his idiotic promise to a lying ho. And HOW exactly would telling FELICITY endanger the idiot child? Nobody is telling him to hold a press conference. Unless Felicity is an assassin Oliver has been long-conning for four years, telling her IN NO WAY endangers that stupid kid.

  9. Stormie Woods says:

    I’m not going into all the reasons the William storyline is stupid. It’s the rancid turd in the toilet and I just want it flushed. I truly loved Felicity and her mom’s scenes they were full of heart which is needed on this endlessly dark show. Lance telling Donna the truth was great and I respected him for it. Curtis is awesome and I’m happy that Felicity will soon walk again. Next week is more of the storyline I hate but I am excited to see Vixen she looked cool.

  10. Stephanie says:

    Aside from all the other things that happened this episode, did anyone pick up on the fact that Oliver said Curtis was “terrific”? As in … Mr. Terrific?!

  11. Jewels says:

    I’ve hated the William storyline from the beginning. I thought it was a thread that really had no place to be explored.

    I like happy Oliver, but dumb blonde Oliver isn’t very becoming. The writers have really taken this team on a wide arc that (while I’m sure there is a method to their madness) really is a bit tiresome.

    Now there may be a device to implant into Felicity to help her walk? So, what was the point of putting her (and us) through all of this? Seems very, very pointless.

    I’m more than a little disappointed.

    • Rob Watkins says:

      The point was that there needed to be a consequence to messing with Darhk or else it was all just idle talk.

      • GirlvsTV says:

        But how much of a consequence is it when it’s overturned a few episodes later? I wish Felicity had more of an active role in creating the tech – that she could have worked with Curtis on it in some capacity – so at least she could have accomplished/learned/developed her character in some way that would have made the injury into more than just a winky nod at a comicbook character she has only has passing resemblance to.

  12. justme says:

    Is anyone else suspicious of Alex now that he had a “family emergency” and couldn’t make it to the debate?

    • Vlada Gelman says:

      My first thought was, “Parker Young must have been unavailable that week.”

    • Dysturbed says:

      I can see why you’d think that it’s suspicious, and you could be onto something, but like Vlada Gelman mentioned, Parker Young could have just been unavailable for filming. It’s my understanding that depending on the terms of an actor’s contract, when someone is recurring on a show, as opposed to being a series regular, they’re not obligated to be available every time they’re potentially needed. The hope is of course that they will be, but if they’re not then there are usually storyline dictated excuses for their absence, or no mention at all.

  13. Bob says:

    i got the feeling that Felicity might be on her way to become Cyborg that would be quite the twist no one would see coming. Cyborg might be a guy in the comic but it wouldn’t be the first time they change drastically a character.

  14. niloofar22 says:

    so Damian Darhk is Darth Vadar now?

  15. datdudemurphy says:

    Well, as long as ya’ll think Oliver is a horrible person for lying to Felicity….maybe we can break this couple up, right? Felicity deserves better doesn’t she?

    Good. Now that we agree, the show can stop being about “Olicity” and it can become watchable again.

  16. Pat says:

    Well now my thinking is that it is Samantha in the grave. Never would she have handed over William to Darhk. Maybe that scene at the grave site with Barry present was in Central City. Changing my mind happened because of last night’s episode. This grave mystery is becoming like spotting the pineapple on Psych.

    • Gail says:

      William didn’t seem upset in the scene. If his mother had been killed or if he was taken by force he certainly would have been at least angry or frightened. I would guess he was just picked up on the street on his way to school and told his mother asked that Darhk take care of him for a while.

  17. Rob Watkins says:

    What was wrong with Conklin as an antagonist? He was smart, he never fell for Oliver’s lies. I’m fine with him being dead, but you act like he was annoying.

  18. pegasus358 says:

    I just don’t get why, if Thea and her people could find that un-cashed check from Moira to Samantha and then make the connection that Samantha and Ollie went to school together, and oh, hey, she has a kid that would be the same age as if she’d gotten pregnant when she and Ollie knew each other– why wouldn’t Thea make the point to Ollie that if she could find all that out, surely Damian Darkh could, too???? I mean, we know that’s not how Darkh finds out, but it just as easily could have been. I can’t wait for next week and that truth to finally come out.

  19. pblo78 says:

    I am one of the few who think that this season “BIG BAD” is Mrs. Dark. At least, his husband care for their child… i dont think she does.
    Thea`s advice is definitely wrong… but all the advices that Oliver got in this chapter were bad. Flashback also.
    We wont see much of wheel Felicity… and it is a pity, cause she is quite a great model for people in wheel-chair.

  20. One thing I didn’t like was in the alternate timeline when Felicity found out, she reacted so horribly and made it all about her. Oliver had literally just found out he had a son, and was given certain terms and conditions, and Felicity got all mad about a secret that he had every right to keep? Oliver was essentially being blackmailed.

  21. 134sc says:

    I’ve been on board with Oliver’s decision to keep William a secret. So I really appreciated the conversation between he and Thea. That being said, I also understand the opposition to that viewpoint. So I get the fans that are upset with Oliver. I think the show has done a great job showing both sides and sparking a debate within the fandom.

    Also the show has done a great job in showing Oliver’s struggle, which points to character development. If this was 2 seasons ago, he would lie without even blinking twice. Furthermore, they’ve done a good job showing Felicity’s growth as well. So I hope when William is no longer a secret, the character growth of both characters will allow for an adult conversation, where both people act mature and understanding to the other person’s situation. I will b disappointed if Felicity flies off the handle, like she did the first time she found out.

    • Gail says:

      Remember that Felicity was not wearing her engagement ring in the flash forward. Apparently they are no longer engaged in the future so something must have happened to break them up. William would be the obvious reason so maybe that is not the reason. I hope they don’t introduce some new reason this late in the season for the apparent broken engagement.

    • amb1973 says:

      If you’re on board with Oliver not telling his soon-to-be WIFE that she’s going to be a STEPMOM, you’re as dumb as he is.

      • tootyfrooty says:

        So it can’t be that 134sc just has a different opinion? He/she has to be dumb?

        • amb1973 says:

          Literally anyone who believes a spouse does not have the right to know the other spouse has AN ACTUAL HUMAN CHILD is an idiot. Similar to how anyone who does not know that 2+2=4 is an idiot.

          • TootyFrooty says:

            2+2=4 is an irrefutable fact. Oliver’s situation is subjective, obviously. There are circumstances that could sway people’s opinions. Some people are on his side and some people aren’t, and that’s fine. What isn’t okay is you calling other people dumb for not sharing you point of view. That’s what my point is, really.

            You didn’t even call 134sc OPINION dumb, you called he/she dumb…but only if they if they disagree with you.

    • kath says:

      In the cross-over, Felicity got angry at Oliver because he lied to her about why he wanted Barry to do something for him. She didn’t mind about the child, she minded because he was lying to her.
      Now he’s been lying to her for months, proposed to her while lying to her, and had no intention of telling her the truth even though they were planning the wedding. If she had reason to be angry back then, she’s got 100x more reason now.

  22. Considering Thea was FURIOUS when she discovered the truth about her parentage and that she was lied too in order to protect her, she was totally wrong. The fact that Oliver is even conflicted should tell him how wrong it is.

  23. Luis says:

    I’d imagine that Thea would have a bit more of a problem hiding information about one’s children from a loved one than she did. Why wasn’t Oliver taking steps to protect William and his mother once Merlyn revealed that he knew about William’s parentage, and wouldn’t that have been a pretty good point to read Felicity and everyone else in?
    Even as everyone was debating about whether Felicity would become Oracle I was thinking ot myself, “Curtis will probably just invent something so she can walk again.” I am a little sad that Curtis’ character has been so underdeveloped.
    I am, however, seriously looking forward to the arrival of Vixen!

  24. Gerald says:

    Oliver and Thea are flawed characters. And regrettably they are going to have a big learning moment when they realize the lie was the wrong way to handle it and William or his mom are killed by Damien and Felicity breaks off the engagement (At least temporarily) when she finds out.

  25. Dawn says:

    I really think the writers and show runners of this show hate the main character. I have no other explanation at this point.

    • kris says:

      Agreed. Either the showrunners are monumentally stupid or they are intentionally sabotaging the character of their leading man. He comes off like an idiot with this string of inexplicable decisions. I have no idea what they are trying to accomplish. I used to be a hard core shipper and now I’m hoping Felicity finds a better guy or just has some more great story arcs of her own. More Calculator perhaps…?

      • amb1973 says:

        The ship’s ruined for me, too. I think Oliver’s now the dumbest protagonist on television. Felicity’s way too good for him. Sara’s too good for him. Laurel’s too good for him. I can’t think of anyone awful enough to deserve him, actually.

  26. DD says:

    I would like to clarify one point – Dahrk does not know that Oliver is the Green Arrow, right??? But wouldn’t Merlin have told him that when he told him everything else (seeing as he is now part of HIVE)???

  27. Captain Average says:

    Clever, the way the writers came up with a way to inspire Curtis’ superhero hero name through Ollie’s thanks at the end of the ep.

    Can’t be too long before we meet Mr. Terrific, eh?

  28. Felicia Hardy says:

    Why does it even matter? Oliver ends up with laurel anyways (Comic version). Its very unfortunate, but I’m just dying for this season to end and for the next one to make some major plot improvements. They are dragging this story line through the mud. The best episode so far in this season has been “A.W.O.L.”

  29. Dj says:

    i thought the Thea scene was awful. I know the writers wanted to have someone talk to Oliver about William and take his side, but giving Thea history it was ooc. The scene would have worked better with Diggle who wouldnt take Oliver side, but being a father who would do anything to protect and be with his child would also understand why Oliver is doing it.

  30. Ella says:

    I found Donna Smoak UNBEARABLY annoying in this episode. Just UGH.

  31. GREENARROWLOVER says:

    It’s William that died. It’s the only thing that makes sense and thinking about it makes me wanna cry. It SO SAD!