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Matt's Inside Line: Scoop on NCIS, Psych, White Collar, Rizzoli, Covert Affairs, Scandal and More!

NCIS Psych White Collar SpoilersWill NCIS fill in the blanks? Will a White Collar romance heat back up? Are things getting “Harry” on Psych? Which Monday Mornings doc copped a role on Rizzoli & Isles? Read on for answers to those questions plus teases from other shows.

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I know Gary Glasberg has mentioned we will see the events that led up to the cliffhanger with Gibbs in the NCIS finale. But will we also get to see what McGee, Tony and Ziva have been doing in their four-month absence? I’m eager to see how they adapted to life outside NCIS and without Gibbs’s rules (particularly Rule No. 12). –Cheryl
If I’m any good at reading between Glasberg’s lines, viewers will be made privy to at least some of that when Season 11 arrives. “The season opener is going to take us from where we left off all the way up to the point where we’re seeing Gibbs [behind a rifle],” he says, As for Tony, Ziva and McGee in particular, “There will be a portion in which they’re still resigned, and then it’ll develop from there. I don’t want to give too much away about the opener yet, but we’ll learn what happened with Tony and Ziva and McGee, I promise.”

I’m curious as to your thoughts on NCIS‘ baiting of “Tiva” fans without delivering. This season, especially, saw the showrunner pushing the notion of the couple becoming a reality, yet once again it did not happen. Even worse, [the finale] found them calling each other “friends,” the same label they applied to each other in Season 9′s “A Desperate Man.” Do you as a reporter find it difficult to see these things teased, when they never come fruition? Or do you think it’s just part of the game and “business as usual”? In addition, do you feel that at some point this bait-and-switch will impact viewership? –Dee
A very sound question, because as you note, I have long witnessed this to-and-fro as well. Quite honestly, I think NCIS and show boss Gary Glasberg face a tremendously difficult juggling act with this (would-be) couple because it is TV’s most watched program, and like a game of Jenga, you can’t be quite sure which slight move could send things toppling. Is NCIS No. 1 because it metes out exactly 25 milligrams of romance every third episode, and never a bit more? Is there a fear that going all-in with Tiva will soap up the show too much? Look at the comments sure to populate below; if one out of three is against the coupling, does that confirm the show would risk disenfranchising some 5 million viewers? (And if you do put them together, will the outcry nonetheless continue if “not enough” intimacy is displayed, a la Castle, presenting a no-win scenario?) All I can do on my end is press for some semblance of concrete evidence behind any loaded quotes (about any topic), then trust the show will follow through to some degree.

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White Collar’s Jeff Eastin had said the Neal/Sara faux engagement would “factor into the new episodes in a crucial way” and that “signs point to yes” in terms of seeing Sara again. With Bridget Regan being cast as Neal’s new love interest, I’m starting to worry about my favorite couple! Is there any news on if/when Hilarie will return? –Julie
When I spoke to Hilarie Burton last month (in the midst of her rabblerousing Grey’s Anatomy arc), she admitted to having “no idea what’s going on” with Sara’s possible return. That said, she agreed that we — and Neal — may need to miss Sara some in order to give her next appearance enough oomph. And the actress is always game for another go-round. “I talked to Matt [Bomer] and Willie [Garson] and Tiffani [Thiessen] over their hiatus and they really are the loveliest bunch of people,” she effused. “I never take that for granted.”

I know that there’s nothing new on the Castle front, so I’d love some scoop for Rizzoli & Isles. –MafaEmily_Swallow
Well, if you’re a fan of TNT dramas in general, I can share exclusively that Monday Mornings alum Emily Swallow (aka Dr. Michelle Robidaux) will guest-star in an August episode as Elizabeth Keating, the parole officer for someone involved in a deadly drag race on Paradise Road.

RELATED | Scoop on Rizzoli & Isles, NCIS, Once Upon a Time and More Via Matt’s Inside Line

Have we seen the last of Eion Bailey (Ben) and Anne Dudek (Danielle) on Covert Affairs? I really loved the chemistry that both of them had with Piper Perabo. –Johnny
Most likely not. As EPs Matt Corman and Chris Ord tell the Inside Line, “Both Ben and Danielle are extremely important figures in Annie’s life. We definitely haven’t seen the last of them.”

Do you know something about Castle or Scandal? This hiatus is killing me! –Martina
I’ll, um, play it safe and go with…. Scandal. If you suspect that, given the roller coaster events of the season finale, newly minted U.S. Attorney David Rosen has turned in his Gladiator card, you’d be right. Sharing his “personal theory” on the matter, Joshua Malina says, “Having spent the time he has with [Pope & Associates], he has newfound respect for them… and he went to school on them. Because he learned that if you really want to be effective – and that’s the sad story of his for the year – pure white hat-edness only gets you so far.” So although Rosen discovered that “getting down in the gutter and fighting dirtier” can get the job done, “I think he considers himself apart from — and possibly above” — Olivia, Abby et al. (Dem’s fighting words, right?)

Can anyone at TVLine.com shed a little light as to what’s going on in this Psych photo? Dule Hill posted it [on Facebook] and I’m very curious now. –EsteePsych_Season8_GusDespShawn
You bet your expecto patronum I’ve got light to shed. You see, the guys are going to “London” at some point in Season 8, so naturally Gus would find a reason to be in a Harry Potter costume, naturally Despereaux would show up (as we already scooped for you), and naturally there will be lots of action (hence the green screen behind them).

When is Arrow Season 2 coming out? –Tanya
When does Season 2 of Beauty and the Beast start? –Nichole
When will Season 3 of Once Upon a Time start? –David
Do you know when ABC’s Scandal will return ? –Stacie
Yeah, so…. The first network to cough up fall premieres dates last year didn’t announce until June 14; and in 2011, it took until June 20. So I’d say we have at least another week until I start building one of these.

RELATED | Fall TV Preview: Your Guide to All That’s New for 2013-14

Of the pilots you have seen, is there anything you really seem keen on? –Brad
I’ve gotten to about six drama pilots thus far – and none of ABC’s, mind you (not that S.H.I.E.L.D. or Wonderland are available yet) – and thus far NBC’s The Blacklist (starring James Spader) and CBS’ Hostages (Toni Collette, Tate Donovan, Dylan McDermott) are topping that list. (Fox’s Sleepy Hollow was shaping up to possibly be a guilty pleasure until its final act uncorked a whole lotta brain-hurting hooey.) And out of the 10 comedies I have screened, Fox’s Brooklyn Nine-Nine (with Andy Samberg and Andre Braugher) and ABC’s Trophy Wife (starring Malin Akerman and Bradley Whitford) look strongest, while the jury’s out on how good CBS’ The Crazy Ones will be sans the “name” client (McDonald’s) and heavily used guest star (Kelly Clarkson) featured in the pilot.

If there’s a summer or fall show you’d like the Inside Line on, email InsideLine@tvline.com!

Comments are monitored, so don’t go off topic, don’t frakkin’ curse and don’t bore us with how much your coworker’s sister-in-law makes per hour. Talk smart about TV!

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809 Comments
  1. Jack Wahl says:

    Matt as always, you da man!

  2. Chocoholic says:

    I’d love to see more TIva on NCIS! They made it happen in Castle, and look at NCIS LA! That Cliffhanger was humongous! I think they could do it. I think the relationships of both Tony & Ziva and Deeks & Kensi can be made to work in an interesting way. Relationships develop and I think both Tony and Ziva are now mature enough (Yes, Ziva had some growing up to do too!) to have a good relationship. I just hope they don’t keep us guessing on how it would end up, like they did with JAG.

    • Erin says:

      Can’t stand “tiva” It’s all about flattering Ziva, which is pretty much what the show seems to be about these days anyway. Tony is completely diminished by this abusive relationship. I wish they could let Tony grow by having a mostly off screen romantic relationship. As long as the show promotes “tiva” Tony cannot develop or grow.

      • Voice of Reason says:

        I am sorry, but how can Tony not develop as a character if he is in a relationship? I do not follow the logic of that statement at all. Maturing to the point that you are able to function in a long-term relationship, and working out the ups and downs of said long-term relationship is the epitome of “growning up” and “maturing”. There are many facets to a man’s life that, if any show is to be authentic about what true character development means for a grown man, need to be explored: professional life, personal life with family and friends, personal growth in terms of coming to terms with past hurts and learning to move on (or not), AND for most adults it ALSO includes having a romantic relationship with someone and building a life with them.Why would you think that Tony wanting to have such a meaningful and lasting relationship with the woman he is in love with (I admit that this point is not universally agreed upon, but I for one 100% think it is the case) and who is his best friend? Why would any viewer who loves Tony as a character want to deprive the character from that richness of life experience? To ignore that aspect of life for Tony is to turn him into a caricature which is what the anti-Tiva people seem to be so aghast about. You can’t have it both ways, either you want hiim to be in a relationship or you don’t… and it is quite obvious at least to me that if anyone is being set up to be Tony’s other half, it is Ziva.

        • Lori says:

          When they started pushing Ziva and Tiva, they began a marginalization of the Tony character that a lot of Tony fans hate. He went from being Gibbs’ witty, smart second-in-command who could fight to being Ziva’s accessory who stands back and lets her do all the fighting. His character development *stopped* and now he is rarely in scenes with anyone but Ziva. The show went from having all these different wonderful character dynamics: Abby/Tony friendship, Tony/Gibbs partnership/friendship, Tony/McGee buddy cop relationship to just being about Tiva. It’s not character development, it is character disintegration. I think this is why a lot of people are against it. It has reduced the show down to little more than “will they have sex?” People say “everyone wants Tiva”, but everyone doesn’t want Tiva.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            Lori, I will repost something I just wrote at the bottom of the page of comments again to you here, as it is relevant to what you have said, also. In one way I agree with you in that the continual stalling and unnecessary roadblocks that TPTB put in Tiva’s path are damaging to the characters. This is the exact point that the person who asked the question to TVLine was making – putting Tiva on percolate indefinitely, as I said earlier, and keeping them in a holding pattern is not working any longer. As we approach S11 it is time to stop with the games and either let Tiva work out a relationship together or move them on to other people that they will be happy with. It is TPTB dragging Tiva out for FAR too long that is creating the issues that you have raised, imho, and not any innate deficiency in either Tony or Ziva’s characters. Both COULD be written well together if TPTB chose to do so. But it seems GG is content to just keep them in this pattern of making slow progress towards a committed relationship but not actually getting them there until the end of the series. THAT is what is ruining the character integrity – in my view, anyway. And this is becoming annoying to people who love Tiva, as well as those who hate Tiva (bec they hate Ziva). It is time for Gary to wise up and deal with Tiva once and for all.

          • anna says:

            Voice of Reason….
            They’ve tried ‘moving them on to other partners’…know why it didn’t work? Because tiva fans had a crap fit over not getting THEIR pairing….the show killed Paula Cassidy off so that she wouldn’t be a threat to Tiva….
            Pretty sad when you think about it….

          • srsly says:

            Don’t forget the nasty hate mail the tivas sent to the actresses who portrayed EJ and Wendy. CBS warned “Wendy” to expect it after SJM got horrific tweets and hate mail. I can only imagine who the tivas will attack when CdP doesn’t sign and how much they will escalate…

          • Voice of Reason says:

            TPTB know full well that anybody they put up against Ziva as a potential partner for Tony is going to be extrenely unpopular by a great many fans, I grant you that. If such actresses were abused, that is very sad… just as it is very sad to see the hatred thrown at Cote constantly by a faction of the fanbase. At least the likes of the actresses who played EJ and Wendy only received such attention for mere weeks, whereas poor Cote has had to put up with it for 8 years now from people like you (not necessarily you, but the arch haters who really do seem to have some kind of vendetta against Ziva/Cote). Attacking individual people involved in the show is never acceptable, imho.

          • Gabi says:

            yes! I’m so done with people being so rude on here. It bothers me, what do you think it’ll do to Cote? Some people just have no heart and I agree with @voiceofreason that it’s enough bashing.

          • srsly says:

            I would seriously doubt Cote has personally received hate mail. SJM was treated abysmally on facebook, her own personal twitter and by direct mail. There is a clear distinction between the two. Just as there is a difference between the dislike of a character and the offensive attacks upon fans who dislike that very same character.

          • z has to go. says:

            Agree with you there, everyone does NOT want tiva. z is a murder waiting to happen, oh I forgot, she’s already murdered two people. If we are lucky Tony won’t be the third.

          • anna says:

            @voice of reason – there is a huge difference between what the rabid tiva fanbase sent to SJM and the Wendy actress and what is said on a PUBLIC message board regarding the character of ziva and the acting abilities of her portrayer. Add to that the disgusting amount of crap that is regularly sent to MW’s twitter feed by that sick subset of the tiva fandom that actually ships MOTE…and the scale really tips

          • Voice of Reason says:

            I can’t believe I got involved in this ridicuous ‘debate’, and have definitely learned my lesson not to do so again. This was my first foray into commenting on blogs and sites about “Tiva”, and I am now shaking my head at myself for having done so. I can now see that there are some of you, such as you @anna, whose “dedication” to promoting the Ziva/Tiva HATE everywhere you can is almost to the point of a full time obsession. I have since discovered that alot of Tiva lovers steer clear of comments sections and NCIS websites because they are just so tired of the constant hate and rehashing of ancient history in the show. I will now do the same and move on from comment here, or anywhere else, about Tiva, as it is a no-win exercise.

            I do want to say one last thing, however, to reiterate that belitting, bullying, attacking or hateful behavior towards the actual actors or other people involved in this show (or any other, for that matter) is completely out of line, no matter who does it. The fact that there are pro-Tiva/Ziva fans who you say have said terrible things about the actress who played Wendy does NOT justify or nullify the same disgusting behavior from the Z/Tiva Hater Brigade that you belong to, @anna / srsly et al. It is a very sad day when any fan becomes so fixated on a show that they think it is acceptable to direct hatred towards people.

            Michael himself has rebuked you “haters” for your calls to get rid of Ziva, and has repeatedly hailed Cote’s amazing talent and fantastic performances. If you could remove your blinders long enough to actually watch the nuances of Ziva’s story of late, you might actually be pleasantly surprised… but you just wont’ allow yourselves to feel anything by hate hate ahte. Very sad. Ths is my last post here. I hope CdP is back in S11 and wish ALL of the actors all the very best professionally and personally.

      • Voice of Reason says:

        Also, one further point about your statement that “Tiva” is all about flattering Ziva. What transpires in the actual show these days is far from flattering all the time for Ziva – eg she actually hurt Tony by sleeping with Adam because she felt alone in Israel when she buried her father. That was most certainly not flattering for Ziva. Some people will read this and then use my words as “proof” that Ziva is actually bad for Tony and that any Tiva relationship is thus proven to be “abusive”, which is also far from the truth. Ziva has helped Tony so much over the 4 seasons (if not more) to believe that he is loved, that he is a good man, that he is a great and loyal friend, and that he deserves to have a wonderful life with his soulmate. Ziva has helped Tony to be able to open up himself to the hope of a very happy future, and has helped Tony to lower his fiercely defensive walls (epitomized by never letting a woman into his apartment) and to let women in. The show has portrayed time and time again that Tony himself knows that no other woman comes close to be good for Tony in these ways, and that his life is FAR the better for having Ziva in it. He himself recognises that he can’t live without her, and that he doesn’t want to, either. We have seen in S10 so many wonderful attributes in Tony and the thoughtful and caring lengths he will go to to be there for the woman he loves; for just one example, his organising that opera music to be played for Tali’s anniversary was incredibly moving and evidenced just how much Tony has grown up, imho. And we have also seen Ziva show great effort to meet Tony half way, to show that she cares and understands him, and that she truly cares about him. The unfortunate “Adam” incident was a mistake that TPTB should not have written into the show after the events of Berlin (again, imho), which brings us back to the original point that Dee made in her question — GG et al set Tiva up and then put unnecessary and poorly considered roadblocks in their path. Doing this too often DOES ruin the characters, I agree, and thus it is my belief that GG needs to either deal with Tiva and let them explore their true feelings for each other, or split them up once and for all. The game he is playing with Tiva, and with Tiva fans, is a very dangerous path to be on at this stage of the NCIS journey. All Tiva fans I know of are very tired of it and quite upset to be used for the ratings in this way.

        • Alisa Neely says:

          i disagree…..have you totally FORGOTTEN, when she called him “DEAD WEIGHT”?…..or threw him to the ground, while he was injured?….or her LACK of RESPECT for him being her CO, when gibbs isn’t around?…..or getting tim to TURN OFF THEIR COMS, while they were his BACKUP during a case…..because, they were TIRED of listening to his voice?…..maybe if ziva was MADE to PAY for some of the things she does….maybe some would change their opinions of her……and WHY would ANY man, want a woman who asks: “what would any woman want from you?”……she puts him DOWN more then trying to HELP….she corners him in the MEN’S BATHROOM……ziva has from day 1, thought she was 100x BETTER then him……if i were him, i’d want NO part of her.

          alisa

          • Voice of Reason says:

            But you are missing the point, Alisa. You are choosing to selectively remember only the darker moments of Tiva history, and some of it is so long ago, without allowing yourself to acknowledge the apologies and forgiveness and mending of relationships and hearts and friendships that has occurred since the Rivkin days. If we lived our lives holding onto the past mistakes of people so ardently as you want Tony to do towards Ziva, then what bitter twisted futures we would have. Ziva has made mistakes, but so has Tony. However, they have BOTH come a very long way towards better understanding and communicating with each other, and are very different people now than they were in Season 6. Surely you can see that? If not, i honestly have to wonder why you are unable to see any positive developments at all.

          • Lori says:

            Thank you! This is a major issue for a lot of people I used to watch the show with. It is not OK to treat someone like this. This is not “love”, it’s abuse. I watch these two characters and I do not get the impression that Ziva loves Tony. She is abusive and insulting and I just can’t see love there. I don’t think Alisa has “missed the point”. Rather, I think she has brought up a very good point and a reason why so many non-Tiva fans have a problem with this pairing.

          • When will Ziva fans admit abuse is abuse? When will the show wake up before ratings plummet? says:

            Voice of Reason, and yet, you are glossing over all of these excellent examples of Ziva’s abuse and disrespect of Tony, many of which have been RECENT and REPEATED. The ones which happened earlier were not something anyone with a stitch of self-respect would forget and enter into a relationship with the perpetrator despite any possible, and questionably advisable ‘forgiveness’. Seriously, even the ‘ancient history’ incidents were only a few years ago. What would get your attention – Ziva killing him or would that just be yet another misunderstanding easily glossed over if not for the inconvenient issue of TONY BEING DEAD? ROTFLOL… Were it to be Tony who treated Ziva in any of these extreme ways, such as throwing her down onto concrete despite her injuries, not backing her up while looking for terrorists, falsely and knowingly accusing him of murder, or bad mouthing her to strangers and people in authority, would this be acceptable? We all know tiva is all about Ziva amongst her fans. Tony fans know he deserves so much better than that crazy witch. Inconvenient truths.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            Again, I have to point out that the extreme examples you use are from Season 6, and ALOT has happened since then — which I admit some of you anti-Tiva/Ziva’s may not be aware of as I have seen some of you say you do not watch NCIS live but record it and fast forward through scenes with Ziva in then… which means that you are completely missing the development of Ziva’s story and the complexity of her transformation that TPTB have been weaving over the last 4 years in rebuilding Ziva after her Somalia experience. The fact that you “tune off” when Ziva is on the show, actually contributes to your inability to fully grasp the storytelling in NCIS, and I suspect it is why you just don’t seem to “get” the show post Season-6 at all.
            In addition to fixating on Rivkin, you also forget all about the constant barrage of abuse and name-calling that Tony directs at McGee which could be seen as abusive, degrading etc etc. You give everyone else on the show a pass for the human frailties, but never afford that grace to Ziva.

          • Gabi says:

            yes yes yes. @voiceofreason
            People just contradict themselves

        • 4luvofncis says:

          i totally agree w/you Voice of Reason (ha, i love that). as well as with the last part about tearing the characters down for the sake of road blocks to keep it “percolating.” that’s called leaving the coffee pot on too long when there’s a little bit of coffee left & it burns the pot & tuns the coffee unto a hard cake of mud,

          • AnotherVoice says:

            Re:VoiceofReason: When was the last time Ziva was supportrive to Tony? Or told him something positive about himself? In S4 she told him he was a “good person.” That and telling him in Reunion that he had her back . And Reunion was three years ago. In the season 10 penultimate episode, she told a Federal Prosecutor that Tony acted childish. Pretty harsh! She disses and dismisses him at every opportunity. How is treating the man you supposedly care for like gum on your shoe in any way healthy? Tony teases and jokes; Ziva goes for the jugular. I think that you are being selective in how you perceive Ziva’s attitude towards Tony, actually.

          • Erin says:

            Voice of reason – You also seem to be cherry picking your facts to fit into your contention that Ziva is right for Tony. IMO she treats him like something nasty on the bottom of her shoe.. She regularly insults and competes with him. She lies to everyone and is NOT a good candidate as a caring, romantic partner for anyone, much less a co worker who she treats with disdain most of the time. I think that “tiva” has kept the writers from being able to develop Tony. He showed a great deal of sensitivity and growth in season 4, before the writers decided to sacrifice Tony so that Ziva could be fan wanked at every turn.

            Add to this the fact that Ziva did in fact assualt Tony (and Hadar) because her lies helped to cost Rivkin his life. She then tried to get Gibbs to kick him off the team because her pride was still stinging. If the tables were turned and Tony had thrown Ziva to the ground fans would have called him an abuser and his character would likely be done on the series. Ziva’s screw ups and tantrums are always excused. The double standards regarding this character are disgusting and an insult to women. and men alike. The victim/wonder Ziva agenda has diminished Tony for years now. Tiva – would be the final nail on his coffin.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            Re Erin: Have you even watched the show beyond Season 6? One does wonder, given your example you are using to justify your distaste for Ziva/Tiva.

          • Gabi says:

            @voiceofreason
            I think we’re all wondering the SAME thing cause there is very obvious Tiva growth since then.

        • anna says:

          What Tony has done for ziva throughout the years are the very same things he’d do for any of his team mates….

          • SAM says:

            Haven’t heard him say that he can’t live without any of them. He’s said that about only one of them, and we know which one it was.

          • anna says:

            Actions in Requiem said the same thing, SAM, along with how vigilant Tony was during the McGee hostage in a jail ep…add to that how grief stricken he was in Grace Period…for all the words he might have said during TorC, his actions do NOT back them up to the extent that ship fans would like to believe….whereas ziva’s words to Tony have always been backed up by her actions

          • Gabi says:

            Are you done repeating yourself over and over again? I’m so tired of people bickering over this. You’re not going to convince us that Ziva is a bad person or that Tiva is a bad pairing. And vise versa. So can we just stop?

          • anna says:

            @gabi – sure…feel free to stop at any point in time :)

      • Alisa Neely says:

        i totally agree with you…..i think, it would be the WORST thing the show could do…..they have to make tony look STUPID and unable to handle himself, when ever he is sent out into the field with ZIVA…..and they seem to think, the fans have TOTALLY forgotten what she did to him after the RIVKIN thing…..NOT SO…..we rarely get the “work smarter, NOT harder ” tony of before ziva…..i’m tired of it always being , ziva is this and ziva is that……SEND HER BACK TO HER BIRTH COUNTRY….she NEVER shoould have been put on TEAM GIBBS…..i’m sick of gibbs KISSING her ARSE….and yelling at tony or head slapping him for NO reason.

        alisa

        * just 1 more thing: MW has ALWAYS been AGAINST the idea……he KNOWS from past work, what it can do to the show…..let alone the characters. *

        • Voice of Reason says:

          You said they should “send her back to her own country”!! That about says it all.

          • BB123 says:

            Alisa, could you please quit emphasing your words like that. It looks like you are shouting, it isn’t easy to read and it doesn’t help your argument at all. It’s even annoying now.
            Back on topic, nothing was forgotten. They just forgive her, based on what happened to her and the fact that she was emotionnally unstable.
            It shows great strengh from other characters.
            Also, I like tony the way he is, because he is like that, but He doesn’t strike me as a great leader since he only wants to be a carbon-copy of Gibbs. He also abused is privilege quite a bit (Again, I love that about him it makes me laugh). However, you can’t respect someone like that as your temporary leader.
            That being said, once Tony man up and try to lead being himself, both Ziva and McGee show him respect !

        • Gabi says:

          Ok you racist bit**. That’s cool. Wtf? That’s so messed uuuup. How about YOU leave it alone? Cause I mean, if it gets you so angry then you should just STOP watching the damn show.

      • paula says:

        I totally agree. Once you are paet of a ship, all about that. Seems Tony cant be seen with talk to anyone else except ziva. Just look at the Abby/ Tony friendship or the Gibbs/Tony friendship, oh wait you cant hecause they don’t excist any more all for a cheap trick call tiva

        • Gabi says:

          Instead of watching this show, since it angers you so much,You should probably go out and get a dictionary.

          • anna says:

            Gabi – you really need to not insult other commenters who disagree with your love for Tiva…

            Not really sure why your comments of hate haven’t been deleted yet since this is supposed monitored

          • Voice of Reason says:

            Oh Anna – the gall for YOU to say such a thing. It makes me laugh out loud!!

          • anna says:

            @vofR….like most of the others who can’t stand the pairing, I don’t level personal insults at posters – a fictional character, OTOH, is completely up for grabs

    • Katrina says:

      I think that McGee and Abby would be a better long term couple. Tiva is fine with me, but I think that the show could always find ways to make the McGee and Abby relationship funny.

      • papnana says:

        I absolutely agree with you Katrina, I think Abby & McGee would make a better couple & so many different ways to go. I guess I am in the minority here, but I don’t think Tony & Ziva belong together, what they get together & than what??? Just my opinion but I think they are a “friend” thing only–more interesting that way.

      • MQ says:

        Katrina, I absolutely agree with You.
        Duo McAbby can be funny.
        Tiva is now (starting long time ago) just bussines and stupid game with fans feeling.
        So….Tiva is boring.
        Have to grow up, or end.

      • felinefriend says:

        I wish there were no team couples on the show. Jimmy & Breena seem to work just fine. I also don’t care for Daddy Gibbs. I liked Gibbs in the first couple of season.

    • Larc says:

      Tiva isn’t what NCIS is all about. Getting deeply involved with it could derail the main plotline entirely and eventually sink the show as too much concentration on the wives sank The Unit. Save it for the last episode in the series.

      • Voice of Reason says:

        It is not ALL of what NCIS is about, but Tiva is most definitely a significant factor in the show now, which I don’t think anyone can question regardless of which side of the pro/anti-Tiva fence you are on. Gary Glasberg said in a postS10-finale interview that he intends to keep using the amazing chemistry between MW and CdP to keep Tiva percolating for as long as possible. So he clearly does intend to keep playing the Tiva card, as he knows that Tiva IS a large part of what does make NCIS tick so well in the ratings. It is not everything, but it is a critical component that Gary knows brings in the viewers. The hugely promoted Tiva (or even just the Ziva promoted eps) rate THROUGH THE ROOF. Which tells me alot about how significant Ziva and Tiva are for this show. That can’t really be questioned by rational viewers, I wouldn’t have thought. But what is questionable is how much longer Tiva fans can stomach being targetted by promotional campaigns that set Tiva up as finally about to become canon, but then fail to deliver… time and time again. That is the question. There is a use-by date for UST.

        • Lori says:

          They pushed “Berlin” as though Tiva would become canon and the ratings dropped by 5 million viewers from the previous week. The season finale arc episodes average a 3-5 million viewer drop in ratings, not so good for a season finale arc. I suppose tptb are going to do what they’re going to do, but I suspect they have underestimated the number of people who will be unhappy with the way they’re taking things. I guess we’ll find out either way, but I don’t plan on watching anyway. I used to watch this show with a group of 25-30 people every week and I was the last person to stop watching. Everyone else had already stopped watching.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            And yet there are another 20-odd million viewers who do still watch!!! And let’s also not forget that Shiva,- a Ziva centric episode – was the highest rated episode of NCIS ever.
            I do grant you, however, that imho GG has teased Tiva for too long now, to the point of frustrating pro- AND anti-Tivas, and if it is not dealt with authentically within the story that has been told to date, then ratings may be adversely affected in S11.

      • Jeff says:

        The Unit had the wife scenes in order to attract a female audience for an obviously male oriented show. Not saying it was good, just that was why they did it.

      • arial2 says:

        Agree with your comment. Until now, this show (the most successful of all American dramas!) has been about the cases, interspersed with the team becoming an effective unit by learning more about each other. Any relationships have been outside the office, so they don’t really interfere with unit cohesion. I know that fiction takes liberties, but in reality I don’t think Tony and Ziva could work together if they were a couple because, in Gibbs absence, Tony becomes her boss, a big “no-no” in the federal government.

        I just can’t believe all the hatred for Ziva I see whenever a Tiva discussion comes up. I’m not sure whether it’s people who hate strong women in the workplace or whether it’s out and out racism because the character is Israeli and Jewish. Either way, people need to deal with these ridiculous prejudices. All of the anti-Ziva comments I’ve seen lately don’t even look beyond the surface: her psyche has been horribly damaged by the way her father brought her up; she realized that, walked away from Eli’s bullying, looks at Gibbs as a better father figure and is trying to change. Old habits die hard, though, especially the inability to trust. I think Tony understands what she’s going through because he’s finally growing up enough to look at a woman as more than just a good time. Look at HIS background: con man father, never knowing whether they have enough money to live on. What I see in this show is two damaged individuals helping each other become psychologically healthier, not just another cheap screen romance. As much as I don’t “feel the love” for Tiva, I am amazed at the subtlety with which the writers handle these two characters.

        • L. Burke says:

          Actually growing up Tony didn’t know anything about his family needing money. He got dumped in to a military academy when he was disowned at 12. He knows NOW the whole ‘disowned’ thing was more about his father saving face about being broke than him actually disowning Tony. Throwing Ziva’s daddy issues together with the hints that Tony’s got some SERIOUS mommy issues under the surface. (The sailor suits in Frame UP and the various vampire fear references through the series. It kind of hinted at a lot darker, creepier stuff there with Mommy dearest). Mix that with the implications both Tony’s parents were/are alcoholics. It’s the reason I’m not a Tiva Shipper. I don’t hate Ziva. I just don’t like her and Tony together at all. Where others see ‘made for each other’ I see ‘get off the tracks’.

        • anna says:

          Hatred for ziva has nothing to do with racism arial2….nor strong women in the workplace because ziva is NOT a strong female character. ziva is a character who is controlled by her emotions and ruled by the men in her life. Add to that, she is a character that cannot stand on her own. she always needs to be by one of the men….that’s not strong

        • Voice of Reason says:

          @ariel2 – I too am shocked at how – when you pick away at what some of the anti-Tiva/Ziva people are SOOOOO angry about – some reveal the underlying motivations behind their hatred for Ziva, which is out and out racism and prejudice. Some (and I acknowledge that not all viewers who don’t want Tiva together feel this way) very vocal anti-Tiva campaigners are so incredibly hostile towards Ziva (and some are towards Cote as well, which is just outrageous if you ask me) that there is no point reasoning with them, at all. Their hatred blinds them to what the writers have down with Ziva’s character over the last 8 years and they are simply unable to see it, and do not want to see it as they prefer to hold onto their hatred for a character that they think has no place in a military show like NCIS. What surprises me the most is why people who hate one of the main characters to this degree, and have done so for 8 LONG YEARS, still bother to watch the show. It makes no sense to me that they would continue to watch something that so clearly causes them such angst and frustration. If I get to the point that I am as disappointment with the show as they are (in my case it would be because the constant roadblocks to Tiva become so inauthentic that it takes away from my enjoyment of the show and what I would consider to be a natural progression for the characters), that I would stop watching, and also NOT feel the need to troll places like this to spread my hate for a MAIN CHARACTER. I can only hope that Cote does not ever come on sites like this and read some of the horrible things people say.

          • Gabi says:

            You took the words right out of my mouth. I completely agree with you. People’s hate towards this character blinds them from seeing the growth that shes made and ahhh your words perfect. I have nothing else to add to that

          • Kate says:

            Oh come on, Voice of Reason! Is it really so inconceivable to you that people may dislike a character who at times: lies, is violent, hurtful, manipulative, a murderer…. without them being “racist”? There’s no secretive, underlying code behind what they’re really trying to say. It’s all there in plain print why they don’t like Ziva or Tiva. Just because you see the true love and tragedy doesn’t mean that everyone else does. That’s not “voice of reason” it’s just your opinion.
            Also, and to Gabi as well, please stop telling people to stop watching. Most of them have anyway, but they still have just as much right as you or anyone else to come here and post their opinion.

          • maybe Voice of Reason says:

            I don’t think it is that simple. Though I have to admit it looks strange when you look at the arguments the haters bring to the table. I have yet to see a hater making a fair, balanced and objective assessment of the character (Ziva). Pointing out every little negative detail while ignoring even the simplest positive ones makes you wonder.

          • z has to go. says:

            I guess if you can’t defend you’re reaon for likeing an abusive character attacking the person that can by calling them names must make you feel better. Racism and prejudice has nothing to do with the fact that I dislike z. I dislike her because she never takes responsibility for her actions, it’s always someone else’s fault. She’s not a stron woman, she’s an abusive arrogant witch.

        • Voice of Truth says:

          You negate every single point you might make by throwing around ludicrous accusations of racism. People have related time and again what they dislike about the Ziva character but you refuse to believe their reasons, which have nothing to do with her nationality and everything to do with how she behaves. She isn’t a strong woman – she’s a truly awful female character who does a disservice to women everywhere. NCIS writes APPALLING women – it has ‘fridged’ them to provide Man Pain, and turns them into smug, superior, prize bitches in most cases (EJ, Allison Hart, Samantha Ryan etc etc) and then wonders why the fans hate them so much. If you want GOOD female characters you need to look to shows like Game of Thrones, Once Upon a Time and Person of Interest.

          I don’t know why we all have to tiptoe round Princess Ziva and her fragile psyche. Several of the characters had a tough time growing up – Ziva actually had a privileged upbringing where her main complaint was not being given a pony. She’s spoiled rather than damaged.

          Tony isn’t ‘finally growing up enough to look at a woman as more than just a good time’. He had a long, committed relationship with Wendy that scarred him when she dumped him at the altar. Since then, he’s had trouble trusting women but he’s a romantic, despite the frat boy persona he adopts to mislead people and protect himself. He fell in love with his undercover mark for god’s sake! It’s Ziva who hasn’t had a long relationship or demonstrated that she’s able to view men as more than sexual partners for her to use in her times of need – witness Adam and the guy from Recoil.

          Ziva is an entirely self-centred personality. It’s ALWAYS about her and her emotions and never about other people and how they might be feeling. That has nothing whatsoever to do with her nationality or her religion. It’s about her personality, and her actions, and the fact the show never makes her take responsibility for how her actions and selfishness affect those around her. Tony can definitely be annoying and inappropriate, and boy, doesn’t the show tell us it, over and over again, having countless characters take him to task for it. Ziva’s flaws are much worse in my view, but the show continuously glosses over them and that is the problem a lot of fans have with the character.

          • BB123 says:

            I agree with the fact that they’re a lack of balance between how people chided Tony for his flaw and …all of the others. Not only Ziva. But it’s true for Gibbs, McGee Vance, Ducky and Abby.
            Tony (and The Gremlins) are always put in their places when they go too far…with reason.
            However, Gibbs countless felony and crime is also shown as the right thing to do (it’s only bring up by villains), Abby childish ways are never comment upon (I adore Abby but even I wanted to tell her to grow the frak up and do her job sometimes, especially when she refuses a direct order) and it goes on and on. The issue isn’t only Ziva V.S Tony, it’s a general flaw of the show.

          • Kate says:

            *Applauds Voice of Truth* You said that perfectly. I love strong women on TV but Ziva is anything but what I’d consider “strong” for all the reasons you stated above.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            I am pointing out the prejudiced and racist view that *some* anti-Ziva fans have, because it is a fact that is evidenced even in the comments made by particular people (not all the anti’s) to this article. It is very clear. Some of the haters posting here are known personalities who have a very long history and trolling Ziva and Tiva (at even Cote) wherever they can, and the racism and prejudice is often even more blatant than is evidenced here.
            I acknowledge that there are balanced, reasonable viewers who don’t like Ziva, but in my mind it is quite easy to identify those ones and differentiate them from the blinded, hateful, prejudiced ones.

        • Pat says:

          Ziva is an adolescent version of a “strong woman in the workplace”. Her immature character uses bullying, bragging, blaming violence, and self pity when things don’t go her way. She is an unrealistic caricature with little subtlety and a character designed to attract the youngest end of the desired demographic with her constant tragedies and super skills. I don’t dislike the character because she’s strong. I dislike her because she is a dated and overused stereotype who doesn’t really belong in a show written for adults who have some expectation that characters will have some actual dimension and depth. I don’t dislike her for her character’s supposed nationality, although the accent is all wrong. I dislike what the constant focus has turned the show into – a soap opera – and the diminishment of formerly rich characters who have been reduced and pared away to make her character fit.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            It really does make me laugh at how you haters say Ziva is to blame for everything that is wrong with all of the other characters, for anything that goes wrong with the ratings, for issues between the cast (that I don’t actually think exist), and for every other terrible thing that goes on in the world ;-)

          • Gabi says:

            Ohhh you’re not the only one Voice of Reason :)) hahaha

          • Voice of Truth says:

            Voice of Reason – how is it trolling for other people to express their opinions on Ziva and Tiva but not for you to express yours? Why are you the only ones allowed to have an opinion? Why don’t ours count? Why are we accused of being racist for saying we don’t like Ziva or Tiva, or accused of being sock puppets and not real? THAT strikes me as trolling, far more than anything else going on here.

            The fact you resort to such disgusting accusations of racism and prejudice when it’s clear nothing of the sort is going on, gives a clear indication to me of your desperation to undermine any criticism of your favorite pairing or character. You have been told time and again why people don’t like Ziva or Tiva, but you choose to ignore it and simply focus on the character’s nationality because you think by doing so you can dismiss the views of those who don’t like the character and in turn call THEIR characters into question. I find that a pretty ugly way of operating, frankly.

            You can call us stupid, blinded by hate, etc and while I disagree and might argue with you over it, it doesn’t bother me, but the minute you throw out a serious accusation like racism, I will call you on it. I’ve noticed Tiva fans doing this before and it’s not acceptable. I don’t think you realize just how nasty and unacceptable it is and how much it affects the way you’re viewed as a group. You should apologize.

      • z has to go. says:

        tiva has already derailed the show. Storylines are brought to a screeching halt so some random person can make a tiva comment. Tony isn’t allowed to have any interaction with anyone but z, the rest of the characters are either invisible or taken out once in a while so fans can see they are still alive.

        • Alisa Neely says:

          totally true….it seems ducky, abby, jimmy and even tim are nothing but SUPPORT characters for ZIVA….tony’s skills as a cop have been thrown out, to make ziva look like she’s some SUPER woman….tony rarely has ANY scenes with anyone, but ziva….he HARDLY ever goes to the lab any more…..there are MORE characters on the show, beside ziva….the connection that was felt between the characters BEFORE ziva entered the scene, is MISSING…..ziva has NEVER shown tony the RESPECT he deserves as SFA…..when she got in trouble….who did she call? GIBBS…..with ALL her lies, that could have and DID get agents KILLED….she NEVER should have been allowed to become a full fledge agent….let alone an american citizen….which was RUSHED…..and as for her apologizing to tony: that is a JOKE…..you CAN’T believe 1 word out of her mouth….she didn’t do it out of the goodness of her heart….ABBY told her to apologize to tony….because he RISKED his life to avenge her (supposed) death.

          alisa

          • Gabi says:

            You’re never gonna convince us that Ziva is a bad person or that Tiva aren’t meant to be. So can you just stop trash talking the entire show? Cause that’s what you’re doing, you’re not even talking about just Ziva anymore so please just stop. If you were a true fan of the show you wouldn’t be talking this much trash and finding all the flaws in it.

          • Alisa Neely says:

            @Gabi: i wouldn’t be doing my JOB as a FAN, if i just sat back and didn’t complain about things that i don’t like…..and i’m NOT the only 1 saying these things…..it’s too bad your blinded by your LOVE for ziva….NOT to see what she has done to the show.

          • Gabi says:

            My love isn’t just for Ziva, it’s for the entire cast, you and anna are trash talking the entire cast now saying how they’re not main characters anymore and whatnot. And your job as a fan isn’t to do that. So please stop being aggressive I was just letting you know that there’s NO way of swaying us to think how you think, which is negatively.

          • Alisa Neely says:

            @Gabi: what we are doing is STATING FACTS….when was the last time, tony went to see abby in the lab?…..when was the last time, we saw ALL the cast together?….and ziva couldn’t even SUPPORT tim, after he shot or thought he;d the undercover cop….it was TONY, who went to try and help tim through…..we are NOT trashing the rest of the cast….we WANT all the characters to have a chance to SHINE….without ziva OVER shadowing them all the time…..and her playing the “daddy” card with gibbs.

            alisa

          • BB123 says:

            The few times Ziva was the one to show compassion and help, instead of another character, I read Ziva hater complains that she, once again, took the place of another character that would be better suited for the job.
            There’s no way to win there…

          • Gabi says:

            Sure you are. You’re just finding every little flaw that Ziva has to try say she’s a bad person. You haven’t said one positive thing about her. Yet you said you fast forward through the scenes she’s in. So how would you know if she’s a good person or not? Exactly.

          • Alisa Neely says:

            i NEVER once said anything about “fast forwarding” anything….so DON’T lump me in with others…..i watch live….and cringe at how foolish tptb have tony acting, while making their female super hero look like she BETTER then anyone else…..and sorry, but imo and others there is NOTHING postive about ziva…..the characters have been turned upside DOWN, since she arrived….and you STILL didn’t answer MY questions….WHEN was the LAST time, tony was in the lab with abby….just to chat?….or teamed with GIBBS, as in the past?…..there ARE more characters on the show, then your FAVORITE ziva…..mine is TON Y….and i want someone BETTER for him, then someone who can NOT be trusted to really have his back.

          • Gabi says:

            How about you chill out? This is so stupid. Everyone getting so heated over this. Thank God I have no doubts in Cote de Pablo, Ziva or Tiva <3

          • Gabi says:

            And fyi my favorite isn’t Ziva. I don’t have a favorite character. So don’t assume.

          • anna says:

            ok @gabi – you better now have examples of where I said the entire cast wasn’t a main character because that’s something I’ve never said….

            and you’re wrong about our jobs as fans….it’s not just to wave pom pons and squee over whatever GG & company put out. One of the things that the producers have talked about in interviews is how much they love the idea that their longtime fans keep them on their toes by remember details they’ve forgotten.

        • SAM says:

          Derailed to the point of it being one of the highest rated shows on TV for the past few seasons. I’m sure many shows would love to be derailed in such a fashion.

          • Gabi says:

            Exactly. If you look at the facts, since she’s been, on ratings have been higher and more people have been watching. So it doesn’t make sense when people say she’s making the show bad.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            Yep, it’s just floundering behind every other show & has completely fallen off the #1 track. Oh, & it’s just gonna keep getting worse because TV audiences simply hate romances between partners & there are so many examples of successful TV shows that don’t have partners that also fall in love or are romantic. I just can’t even think of a single one.

    • Gabi says:

      I totally agree. We’ve waited long enough right? Come on Gary!

      • anna says:

        because, of course, it’s only all about what the tiva fans want & how long YOU’VE been waiting

        • 4luvofncis says:

          I don’t think she has to spell it out for you. She’s the one making the statement. It IS about what she wants & she’s including herself in a collective group of people that want the same thing. Does that mean that’s what the show is about- making TIVA fans happy? Yes, no, maybe. Prob not. Who knows. But that’s not what she said, is it?

        • SAM says:

          As opposed to your demanding that they get rid of Ziva, preferably by killing her off. Which a majority of fans do NOT want to see happen.

          • Gabi says:

            ohmygod. Why is everyone so against these two? Don’t you want to see Tony finally settle down with the woman he loves? Because yes, he does love her and he’s shown it in SO many ways. I have no idea why people would be against these 2 characters being happy together.

        • BD says:

          It never ends with you people, does it? While I agree with you, do you actually think this does anything? (Rhetorical question, don’t worry.)

      • paula says:

        You can keep on waiting. Dont want hear or see any more tiva crap. Im just sick to death if it. Every one making ncis nothing more than tiva. all but stopped watching it because of it. I record it now and wait to see what others say first. Good going tptb for ruining a one of a kind show and making just any other show. It stopped being unique and different when you kept ziva

        • 4luvofncis says:

          Let’s follow this logically through: What most likely started first; a bunch of fans saying, “No, no, no, no romance, please!” or a bunch of fans noticing a romance or the writers wanting fans to see that, and they said “yes, yes, we want TIVA!” and then a bunch of fans argued with that?? I believe it’s the 2nd, & that the only reason that TIVA started being such a ridiculous debate is because people who are against it started voicing their opinion constantly. I’m NOT saying anything is wrong with that. But that’s why you’re seeing the TIVA “crap.” If people who didn’t agree with it didn’t say anything, it wouldn’t be talked about all over the media. I couldn’t disagree more that this show isn’t unique, & one of the reasons IT IS is because of Cote.

          • Gabi says:

            I totally agree with you. I think that Ziva made this shjow SO much better and idk why people wouldn’t like her. I think she’s really helped the show.

          • anna says:

            Bull – if people who didn’t like the pairing chose to not say anything like you advocate then what you’d have is canon tiva. Brennan himself said he was surprised at the sudden amount of dislike for the character of ziva and the tiva pairing after s6…and it was because, prior to that, there were very few people talking against the character/pairing.

            There’s tiva crap because that seems to be ALL that sites like this and EW will talk about when it comes to this show. They barely talk abotu anything else but ziva/tiva. and now, if anything, those fans that aren’t for the pairing need to speak up even more because the only ones that the media seem to listen to are those that are clamoring for the whole romance to be spelled out nauseating scene by scene

          • 4luvofncis says:

            thank you for proving my point, anna

          • z has to go. says:

            So only the peoplle that are against the pairing need to be quiet about it, according to you, why don’t the people that are for the pairing stop demanding that they get what they want no matter what? There is no debate with only one side talking. TPTB need to know that not everyone is for this toxic pairing. so no, those of us against the pairing will not stop talking about it so you can put your rose colored tiva glasses back on and drink your tiva kool-aid and pretend that NCIS is nothing but a soap about the life and trails of Princess Super Wonder Woman Victim z.

          • L. Burke. says:

            In Ziva’s defense.
            I think a lot of the truly ignorant things that come out of Ziva’s mouth that a lot of fans object too aren’t so much a reflection of the character but the show writers just being moronic.
            For example the line Ziva threw out about Tony ‘not knowing what it’s like to wear a uniform’. Which was probably the MOST ignorant thing the writers have ever had come out of Ziva’s mouth. Some fans took it as her being disrespectful. I just took as stupid writing. No Tony never served in the military but he blasted well knows what it’s like to don a bullet proof vest every day, report for a shift and hope to make it home in one piece. Any one that’s worn a police uniform does. You can bet as a cop Tony’s probably seen as much alcohol fueled induced carnage on a holiday weekend as Gibbs has seen on the battle field. I think the recent events in Boston and California kind of opened some eyes about what our police officers are up against every day.
            It is a flaw of the writing of the show itself.
            Mossad Spy, Super Hacker, or retired Marine Sniper is a lot more interesting that plain old boring cop. So Tony gets slotted in to comic relief and his skills get downplayed. There was a time where the show balanced the domestic law enforcement vs. the military a lot better. Maybe Ziva was one of the factors that helped unbalanced the show. You could argue that one either way. Either side has valid arguments about that.
            Here’s something to think about. Have we ever seen back drop of National Law Enforcement Memorial on the show? Despite the fact technically there should quite a few names of the friends of the NCIS team on that wall. Have we ever seen Abby, Tony or Gibbs say go visit Kate’s name on that wall? We’ve seen the backdrop of pretty much every war memorial but not even a mention of the National Law Enforcement Memorial and the 20,000 names it displays.

          • BB123 says:

            That you don’t understand, and some other people doesn’t get it either, is that I have nothing against anti-tiva fans.
            However I saw a difference between saying ” I don’t like Ziva because she’s all too good with everything . The way they write her all powerfull put demish the other characters, especially Tony, and unbalanced the show. I also don’t like that the character seems intitled to everything and never take responsabilities of her act. I still didn’t forgive the assault against Tony. IMO, She shouldn’t have been admit in the U.S again after spying on the country”, and whatever else people doesn’t like about Ziva.
            I read very few message like that, but I can discuss with people, because they are polite about it.
            However? here, we mostly read degrading nicknames about Ziva, insults and personnal attack against the actress and shouting theirword like we’re a bunch of stupid people that can’t understand things if you don’t put the important part on capital letter.I remember someone calling her a witch not so long ago,
            The smart thing to do would be to ignore people like that. But we aren’t always smart. (And I am proving that right now).

          • Gabi says:

            Thank you BB123! I’m with you 100%.. I’m so tired of the rudeness.

          • anna says:

            @BB123

            you talk about ‘degrading nicknames for the character’ yet fail to realize that these nicknames are born from the highly unrealistic skill set and various other ridiculous fight (& other) scenes pushing the character forward.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            and thank you, z (doesn’t have to) has to go, for proving my point as well. i’m simply stating that the rippling of the debate is because initially, fans not in favor of TIVA, started responding to those who did & commented on it. i never said anything about people not expressing their opinion. but instead of letting it go, & letting people fantasize about the pairing or wish for it come true, without feeling the need to be critical of or argue with those comments or the pairing, it seems to me, it is more likely for someone to respond in opposition to a TIVA fan than the other way around. i don’t have glasses on (i wear clear contacts) & i’m not drinking kool-aid (not since i was a kid); “that which is essential in invisible to the eye.”

    • DeeJay says:

      I could not agree more. I also love that you are a Chocoholic!! Me, too!! If NCIS-LA can cope with an adult relationship on its show, then surely NCIS can, too. The forehead kiss in the NCIS finale, compared to the “take the bull by the horns and show that woman how I feel” kiss on NCIS-LA, well it says alot about the integrity of the story-telling, the willingness of the writing team and showrunner to deal with their characters authentically, and (in my opinion) how in touch the writing team is with the younger TV viewer base… which is supposedly the be all and end all for network TV these days. Tony and Ziva have definitely had their rocky patches, and there have been faults on both sides — which is as it should be, no people and thus no characters in shows are perfect and it makes sense to explore characters’ weaknesses and strengths. BUT, to say that Tony has not matured over the years just does not stack up when you look at the actual show. He has proven himself to be dependable when it matters, and always there for Ziva. Ziva herself has grown considerably over the years, also. I personally take issue with how both characters were written for the last 3 episodes of S10, however, and do wonder what on earth the writing team or the showrunner is playing at. The 2 steps forward, 20 steps back dance that they have Tiva doing is tiresome for everyone, haters, lovers and the non-plussed alike. NCIS needs to stop toying with fans, make a decision regarding Tiva one way or the other, and then do it. There will be fans who love and hate whichever outcome, but that’s just the way it is. No fanbase is 100% united in what they want, but surely Gary and team have enough confidence in their own ability to write quality stories that are TRUE to the human condition and thus resonate with viewers, to be able to pull off an exploration of an adult relationship between Tony and Ziva. If not, then they need to hire other writers who CAN write such stories. And we know for sure that Matthew and Cote will “play the pants off” such a storyline if they are given the opportunity to do so – pun intended ;-)

    • Voice of Reason says:

      I am sorry, but how can Tony not develop as a character if he is in a relationship? I do not follow the logic of that statement at all. Maturing to the point that you are able to function in a long-term relationship, and working out the ups and downs of said long-term relationship is the epitome of “growning up” and “maturing”. There are many facets to a man’s life that, if any show is to be authentic about what true character development means for a grown man, need to be explored: professional life, personal life with family and friends, personal growth in terms of coming to terms with past hurts and learning to move on (or not), AND for most adults it ALSO includes having a romantic relationship with someone and building a life with them.Why would you think that Tony wanting to have such a meaningful and lasting relationship with the woman he is in love with (I admit that this point is not universally agreed upon, but I for one 100% think it is the case) and who is his best friend? Why would any viewer who loves Tony as a character want to deprive the character from that richness of life experience? To ignore that aspect of life for Tony is to turn him into a caricature which is what the anti-Tiva people seem to be so aghast about. You can’t have it both ways, either you want hiim to be in a relationship or you don’t… and it is quite obvious at least to me that if anyone is being set up to be Tony’s other half, it is Ziva.

      • 4luvofncis says:

        Oh how I love this post. I 200% agree with this, and it is exactly on point!! Thank you for your thoughts!

      • Gabi says:

        @voiceofreason
        Your words are golden. I agree with you 1094847489201%. FINALLY someone on here sees the same love that I see. THANK YOU!

    • Ana Rubio says:

      I totally agree with you, I really think they could make it work, both Tony&Ziva and Deeks&Kensi. They are great show I’m sure they will find the balance. Besides, it’s gonna be season 11 for NCIS, how long can they delay it without losing the emotion?

    • jake says:

      It will never happen. Conflicts with Gibbs’ Rule 12 – Never date a co-worker. Tony has already run afoul of Rule 12 with E.J. Barrett. Gibbs won’t countenance him breaking the rule twice.

  3. NoChance says:

    Regarding ‘NCIS’ /Season premier in general/Tiva: And there’s no word on how contract negotiations are going between the studio and Ms de Pablo. Didn’t the women from ‘Criminal Minds’ have to settle for a significant amount less than they’re male conterparts?
    Thank you MA for pointing out that there are a significant a mount of viewres who don’t want this pairing and a lot of folks don’t post to message boards or entertainment sites.

    • SAM says:

      As opposed to a significant number who do want to see it.

      • 4luvofncis says:

        Thank you, SAM. Exactly.

      • anna says:

        and they mostly all post to twitter or sites like this and EW demanding that they get what’s ‘due’ them

        • SAM says:

          As do you by going to the same places demanding that the show get rid of the character that you don’t like, that they get rid of the actress you can’t stand.

          • anna says:

            actually no SAM…I’ll post here, EW and Tv Guide. Twitter is an absolute waste of time…

          • SAM says:

            Anna, it is a known fact that you have posted on Twitter in the past. You want to deny it, go ahead, but honestly, you’re wasting your time doing so. As for the rest, yes, I know you post on those places that you mention — I post there too, as do a number of Tiva fans, who you quite often post negative responses to, just as you did here. You are consistent at it, I’ll give you that much, for sure.

          • Lillian says:

            @SAM, I suspect this is the only thing on which I’ll agree with you.

          • Lillian says:

            I mean re: Twitter

          • anna says:

            SAM (& Lillian) I haven’t had a twitter in well let’s see…it’s either at or over 3 years now….it’s a pointless waste of time

          • Susquehana says:

            “SAM (& Lillian) I haven’t had a twitter in well let’s see…it’s either at or over 3 years now….it’s a pointless waste of time
            Comment by anna – June 9, 2013 11:27 AM PDT ”

            https://twitter.com/MissAnnaMack funny… this handle is still very much active and Anti-Ziva…. tsk tsk tsk…

    • James says:

      I don’t think it’s going to make any difference. The lack of news leads me to believe that Ms DePablo is NOT Returning!!

      • SAM says:

        Or that they are still in negotiations, or that they are in the process of drawing up the contract and are hammering out its exact language. MW didn’t sign last year until a week or two before work on the season started. Likewise SM before work started on the 8th season. Sometimes work on these things go right down to the wire.

    • Voice of Reason says:

      I have not posted about Tiva before. I have not been to any forums, either. And yet I am an enormous lover of the relationship that Tony and Ziva have, and the amazing potential for what coudl be, if only GG would not be so fearful of going there sooner rather than later. So the fact is that there are a great many viewers who LOVE Tiva who don’t post on these type of blogs or forums, too.

  4. Terry says:

    Can you get any kind of scoop out of Homeland… preferably about Carrie and Quinn. Thanks.

    • Alex says:

      Carrie is busy, between testifying in front of congressional hearing and looking for evidence that exonerate Brody, oh, and helping Saul rebuild shattered CIA.

      I do have a maojor spoiler about Dana, but not sure you really wanna know.

  5. Alex says:

    Matt, is the new series “Rake” really that bad???

    • Matt Webb Mitovich says:

      RAKE is midseason, and I always watch fall pilots first. (Plus, RAKE’s trailer looked pretty meh.)

      • justsomeguy says:

        Glad I wasn’t the only person to watch the trailer and think it was bad. A lot of people seem to be enthused about it, but I didn’t see anything in it that seemed even remotely interesting.

    • mia says:

      I got to see Rake’s pilot, and let’s just say, unless they make some changes, I have no desire to see any more.

  6. Mel says:

    Great answer to the Tiva question, Matt. I’m sure extremes on either side will make it very black and white, but it really is more shaded and complicated than that. Which ever way the show goes, will be a risk. Personally, I just want good writing, characters written with depth instead of stereotypes, and for the show to give each actor a chance to shine in S11.

    • Lisa says:

      ^ This.

    • Patricia says:

      The second half of the season was all about Ziva shining. I’m beyond sick of her tragic melodramas. They’re cheezy. Gibbs always gets his turn. I’d like to see Tony get more than a one and done and not have to be chained to Ziva in every scene.

    • prish says:

      My husband wants a realistic maturing of Tony and a realistic, slow growth of any possible relationship with Ziva. Me, I had them hooked up from the beginning, just took it for granted. I was shocked, years later, to find he was aghast at the possibility. He couldn’t see it. Then, a year’s worth of episodes later, he started to see a relationship growing. So, their snail paced relationship works, if that is where the creators want to go. They do have to be careful not to make Tony appear frivolous or dismissive, if they don’t get them together. My husband still gripes about the Who’s the Boss ending, years later.

      • Alisa Neely says:

        he KNOWS how it can effect the show and the characters…..it happened to him in the past…..i’m NOT sure, which show it was…..it could have been, back when he did the soap : ” Loving”…..i can’t blame him….i’d like to see tony GROW as an AGENT….and actually SHOW those who don’t understand WHY he’s or was gibbs’ 2IC …..SFA and why he was with NCIS for so long….i’d like for him to STOP putting up with the DISRESPECT from other agents…and that includes GIBBS……i think, whatever relationship MW might have seen….could have been “friendship”…..he might even love her as a friend……i would HOPE, tony has BETTER standards for his heart…..then someone who throw him to the ground and pull a LOADED gun on him….and be HAPPY to shoot him….let alone, ask gibbs to PICK between them…..which i’m NOT sure, he knows about.

        alisa

        • BB123 says:

          Alisa
          Tony needs to show more respect to others too. It’s a two way road sweetie. Tony’s isn’t known to be respectfull to others.

          • Alisa Neely says:

            as SFA they should show it…..tony has been with NCIS longer then tim and ziva…..look HOW they treated him, when gibbs turned the team over to him, when he left…..of course saying, “You’ll Do”….didn’t help either……sorry, ziva doesn’t honestly KNOW the meaning….she had ALOT of nerve demanding gibbs PICK between her and tony that time…..and she would NOT have “thanked” him for saving her sorry butt….if abby and gibbs HADN’T told her, she should……he risked his LIFE for her….she CAN’T be trusted…..tony would NEVER leave his partner WITHOUT backup, the way BOTH tim and ziva did that time.

            alisa

          • Voice of Reason says:

            OK, so it has become very clear why most viewers steer clear of this topic when you see the types of posts that are coming up now. There is no point even trying to have a reasoned conversation with you Alisa, you are determined to hate Ziva and I do not think that anything could possibly make you change your mind, no matter what amazing things TBTB might do with Ziva’s character. So there is no point engaging with you on this matter any more. I hope that my own disappointment in the way S10 ended, and the frustration I currently feel at being toyed with by Gary and others who promoted Tiva and then didn’t deliver, does not make me end up being as hateful and bitter towards the show as you so clearly are now. I hope I would have the courage to walk away from the show (and blogs about it) if I got anywhere near your level of disgust with the show and all of the characters in it, or so it seems from reading your posts. It is scary, quite frankly.

          • anna says:

            hey voice of reason –

            While you’re busy lambasting alisa for not being able to have a reasonable conversation with her because she ‘obviously hates ziva’ don’t forget about your tiva buddies – you know, the ones who are so rabid in their love for ziva and the pairing that there is no point having a conversation with them either

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @anna – I have read through all the comments on here and what I see is Tiva supporters trying to have reasoned, thoughtful discussion. What Alisa (and SOME other Ziva haters) do is shout at people, throw around unsubstantiated and venemous insults, and make racist remarks. I cannot support that kind of behavior, and I wouldn’t if it came from Tiva supporters, either. But the thing is, the really angry hostile posts are typically from people who are just so hateful towards Ziva… and it is becoming very clear to me why that is — and the answer is not pretty! Or acceptable in a civilised community that does not live in the Dark Ages!!

          • Gabi says:

            Thank you! My words exactly.

          • Voice of Truth says:

            Voice of Reason – throwing around accusations like ‘racism’ simply because you can’t rebut someone’s argument, or you don’t agree with it, is really ugly behavior. Just when I think the Tiva fans couldn’t sink any lower in my estimation, you do.

            I’ll sign off now – this debate is insane.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            I agree, it is a sad day when fans like myself feel forced to point out the ugly motivations underlying *some* anti-Ziva/Tiva posters, That may not apply to you, @VoiceofReason, but it surely does apply to others who are posting here. They know it, and though they try to hide it, the truth of it does come through when you read all of certain people’s posts.
            I apologise to those of you who don’t feel any connection to Ziva (but who are reasoned and balanced in your posts) if you feel that you have been unfairly lumped in with the faction of anti-Tiva/Ziva’s who ARE outright prejudiced and racist. That was not my intention here. But let’s not pretend that such people don’t exist.
            I am more than happy to try and have a balanced, considered, thoughtful, respectful discussion with anyone about Ziva, if they are willing to actually talk about the positive developments that TPTB have written into Ziva’s story since S6, and not only dwell on the S6 episodes and see everything positive for Ziva/Tiva since then as irrelevant. If you read my other comments on here, you will see that I HAVE mentioned some faults of Ziva, but unfortunately the haters instead prefer to just attack because I don’t throw my arms up and agree with them that Ziva is the devil spawned.

          • Gabi says:

            Some people just have a rude approach. @voiceofreason I totally understand what you’re saying.

        • guest says:

          Find something new to say please. We all know that you feel that poor Tony is not respected! Do you have anything else to add to your daily diatribe?!? And just like everyone else on the TV Fanatic page and this page; stop capitalizing your words! It isn’t necessary. How old are you? 12? Because your obvious crush on Tony and hatred for Ziva is very .immature.

  7. Sarah Beth says:

    Bradley Whitford back on my TV? I vowed to say no to any new shows on ABC after they axed Happy Endings…but I would do anything for Bradley Whitford.

  8. Daisy says:

    The Blacklist trailer looks very good, cannot wait for the show to premiere in the fall.

  9. Becca says:

    The whole Tiva debate is really interesting. I don’t watch NCIS (nothing against it, just never got around to it), but I feel like the show not following through on that relationship yet would be really frustrating as a viewer. But I don’t know that it would make me stop watching a show that I’d already invested so much time in. I love Castle and was ecstatic when Castle and Beckett got together this season, but I probably would have kept watching even if they hadn’t. I can see how there’s a greater risk in trying something new with a couple then just leaving them the way they are (albeit with some justified complaining from fans). I think they did a pretty solid job on Castle with this, though I still have to go with Chuck and Sarah for best transition from will-they-won’t-they to actual relationship.

    • BB123 says:

      Well, Tiva isn’t the focus of NCIS. It would be nice to see that happens but it isn’t as frustrating than it was for Bones where the relationship was the Focus. Or IT would have been for Castle.

      That being said. It’s really annoying. As a NCIS fans I am not a Tiva fan anymore. I was. Now I don’t care. Put them together, leave them as friends I don’t care either way but put a end of this storyline, please. The back and forth is starting to get annoying !

    • prish says:

      My husband never got around to NCIS, either, until a few years ago, just me watching it. Then, he ended up watching the reruns, over and over, these recent years. The show is addictive if watched in sequence. He can’t remember what sparked his interest, finally. I never watched it with him around. Give it a try.

    • srsly says:

      Imagine how frustrating it is for a viewer who sees Ziva continually verbally abuse, disrespect, and berate Tony, both as a ‘friend’ and as her superior after physically assaulting him while he was injured, wishing him dead and accusing him of murder and see the show and its publicists push them as a potential couple without regard to the problematic issues of partner abuse. For that matter, imagine the frustration of a viewer who sees their show they have followed for 10 years go from a quirky ensemble show about characters who like each other enough to razz each other to a soapish, unimaginative shlockfest concentrating on Daddy Gibbs and Mossad Mary Sue, with the rest of the characters neutered and rendered as little more than caricatures of the rich, layered characters we were introduced to 10 years ago. Imagine how a viewer feels about Gibbs allowing a spy and betrayer to join his team all for a chisel. Imagine how a viewer feels about the entire cast of characters’ integrity destroyed to further Ziva’s craptastic story line. Yeah, about that…

      Castle was designed for their couple NCIS not only wasn’t, but have chosen to present it as a woman who can barely stand to be around the man to the point of potential violence and belittlement at every turn. For many viewers, abuse does not equal entertainment. NCIS is done next season if CdP returns.

      • Gaara says:

        I often wonder if there’s only one (very) pissed Anti-Tiva/Ziva/Cote/etc writing these kind of comments or if you all have some kind of identity issues, since you all write the same exact things using the same words, expressions and a very similar writing style… Every. Time.

        Regardless, I once showed some of these copycat posts to a friend who is a “common” fan of the show (not a shipper or a member of the fandom) and, lol, her face was something like this: ?????¿¿. She couldn’t believe they where talking about the same show she watches without missing an episode – and me neither.

        • anna says:

          you wish there was only one fan who was against tiva….it seems, rather, that the number is growing every time TPTB force more anvils in the show.

          • SAM says:

            No, it’s pretty much the same low number it’s always been. You and the rest are just working overtime to respond to larger numbers who are for what you are against.

          • Gabi says:

            Hahahahahha I like you. And it’s true. Tiva all the way <3

          • Jo says:

            Well, it certainly is the same few people over and over and OVER again on the Television Without Pity Forum. They have driven nearly everyone away with their constant rehashing of Ziva’s “abuse” and “poor Tony,” by saying the SAME thing every few pages! At least they have added some variety in the last couple of months; they now hate Gibbs, Ziva, and Vance! I honestly don’t know why they watch the show.

        • Patrick M. says:

          Thank you! Ever since I made the mistake of reading some of these comments I have noticed the same thing. Same comments over and over–poor, abused Tony always being “picked” on or “threatened” with a gun. Mean old Ziva–and her “craptastic” this or that, I feel like I’m reading comments from an 8th grader. (Plus, the commentators may have different names–but the repetitiousness is ALWAYS constant). Like your friend, I am a fan of the show (since Yankee White) and I can’t believe how the comments do not match the show I watch–truly it’s a very sad commentary on how delusional some people are.

          • BB123 says:

            To be fair, I think they are more than one people who hate Tiva and Ziva. Of Course there’s always that one person who do comment the same think with multiple names, but antiTiva are plenty.
            However they have so few reasons and argument, and this is just pure hate that they can’t help but say the same things, use the same sayings and arguments over and over and over and over. To the point it seems to be the same person. They just have not so much to say so they all say the same things.
            To be fair (again), they’ere also Tiva Fans that comments with multiple names and can’t come up with their own argument and so repeat that they read elsewhere.

            Back to the topic, I really don’t get the “Ziva is an abuser etc”. Maybe. But not less than Gibbs who happyly slap almost everyone, not less than McGee that hide things from Tony that Tony could enjoy just because….We don’t really know. And not less than Tony himself and his behavior toward McGee or Ziva herself.
            If you don’t accept Tony being pick on by Ziva (and the others), I don’t know how you can watch the show. That kind of things happens in every episode between all of the characters.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            I concur 100%. The rantings of some commenters on here do not match the actual show and what transpires between the characters. Bitterness is a sad reality to live in, isn’t it. I wonder why these people who hate Ziva so vehemently, and then also hate all the other characters because of how they think Ziva has ruined everyone and everything in the show, still bother to even watch, let alone comment so frequently on blogs like this.

          • Gabi says:

            @Patrick
            Yes! I’m with you 110%. Idk what show some of these people are watching, but their description of Tiva and Ziva just doesn’t match up at all with the love I see between these two on and off set.it’s kinda like they want to hate her. But I don’t see how that’s possible. Cote is one beautiful human being and also very close with Michael sooo idk. People confuse me.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            100% agreed, Patrick. They are stuck back in S6 and in effect have not actually watched (understood) the show since then.

          • Gabi says:

            Yeah Patrick, you’re right on. They haven’t seen the growth in these two because they fast forward through the Ziva scenes but still try to argue that she’s an abuser and whatnot. That’s so contradicting.

          • BB123 says:

            As I can admit some Tiva fans are way too in love with Ziva and Cote, I have to say it’s exactly the same about some anti-tiva fans with Tony and Michael Weatherly.
            That kind of fans bring up the fact that Tony’s a romantic since he fell in love with Jeanne. They forgot that the guy seduce her on purpose while she was an innocent, and she payed for the sin of her father. Tony was a manipulative bastard there.
            I agree, it was his orders, But he could have refuse the mission. Perhaps, it would have cost him his job, but if he was the big romantic white prince they imagine he is, he would have done it.
            They bring up the end of season 6, totally forgeting that Ziva sent herself in a suicidal mission because she felt guilty and even about what she done to Tony. And She hated that Tony put himself in danger for her, that her apologize were genuine, that she risked her life for him. That she seek redemption and acceptance and took change her nationality. That has to be hard.

            By the way, I apologize for my mistakes, I am not English, I am still learning the language. Do you think I can stay there or should I go back to my country ?

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @BB123 – you have the best sense of humor!! I love you!!! Thank you for explaining your viewpoint so well. I completely agree.

        • srsly says:

          You know what is so funny, Gaara? That you tivanistas insist that it is twu luff even with Ziva’s unending history of abuse and abhorrent behavior towards Tony while ignoring and excusing every single incident between them that doesn’t work out for your vision and then, when that doesn’t work, you try to insist that there is one person posting all of these messages when you know there are a legion of fans who see the Ziva obsesses about Tony story line for what it is. You can make all of your allegations and excuses, but it doesn’t change anything or make it what you want it to be. Deal with it. We have canon facts for our viewpoint and aren’t stupid enough to just follow the company line when a writer wants to write Ziva into yet another problematic corner and then hand wave it away. We watch the show, not extrapolate our own canon to suit our fanon and then insist the show screw over every other fan, so we don’t have to have an imagination. OK, so that’s not funny – just sad.

          • Gabi says:

            @srsly
            Someone needs to catch up on some recent NCIS. Cause I would’ve seen your point, if we were talking about seasons 3-6. Their growth is so obvious thay I have NO idea how you could possibly think that Ziver is still abusive to Tony.

          • anna says:

            Gabi – she’s called him dead weight, abuses the chain of command where he’s concerned, has no respect for him as a person, wonders what a woman would see in him, barely describes him as ‘competent’ etc…

            & guess what? this is all s7-onward

          • srsly says:

            Gabi, after I got past the major suspension of disbelief her presence required on the team, I enjoyed the character in varying degrees until about halfway through season 6 at which time she was written into the nasty piece of work we have had ever since. Ziva lost a lot of fans during that arc and has continued to lose them as she continues to be written as a bad girl who is never held accountable even while acting with such a sense of entitlement you just want her to finally piss off Karma enough to see her get what she deserves. Shane Brennan, himself, stated in an interview how shocked he was at the backlash against the character. He was so caught up in wanking her that he had no idea how he was presenting her, which is a puzzlement to me even if we only consider the reveal that she was spying on the United States for 4 years! WHAT WAS HE THINKING??? Spies don’t get sympathy, they get frogmarched onto planes bound for home in chains at the very least and sent to ‘Gitmo at worst. The character’s expiration date came due at that time and she needs to go. I hope CdP does not get her demands met – she hasn’t earned them and doesn’t deserve them. CBS needs to continue to turn her down and she needs to move on to something else where there are girls to braid hair with.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @srsly said:
            “I hope CdP does not get her demands met – she hasn’t earned them and doesn’t deserve them. CBS needs to continue to turn her down and she needs to move on to something else where there are girls to braid hair with.”
            This type of comment proves what kind of attitude you actually have. Cote has acted her socks off this previous season and her amazing performances have been hugely accolaimed by sites such as TVLine and many others. Shiva, her centric episode, was THE highest rated episode of the show EVER!!
            Regarding Ziva’s story on the show, it is unfortunae that you are unable to see that when Ziva returned from Somalia and came to understand that NCIS was her true family, she turned her back on her blood family, her country, Mossad, and all that her previous life meant to her, and committed to NCIS and became an American Citizen. You may not WANT to accept that fact, but that is what has actually happened on the show. If you prefer to watch a show where the main character are spying against the U.S., I suggest you watch The Americans, instead. I do wonder how you would cope with such a show that purposely explores the grey areas of life, even amidst Cold War times.

          • Gabi says:

            Absolutley, I’ve been trying to say that but they can’t get over the past. It’s really bothersome. I hope that with that comment they will finaly understand that Ziva’s real family is NCIS and no longer Mossad. Thanks you voice of reason

          • BB123 says:

            The americans that is a good show. But if she fall in love with Philip, then Elizabeth will be the slut hat cheated on him multiple time, wouldn’t want anything to do about him and kick him out of his home that b*tch. Forgetting that Philip did the exact same thing and lied to her. But Philip will have very good reasons to have done that while Elizabeth would be just a whinny russian that need to go back to her contry !

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @BB123 – you are hilarious!! Can you even imagine how some of the hater types would cope with a show like The Americans. Or Homeland!! Haha. It must be a hard life when everything you see is black and where there are no shades of grey, or color and warmth, love, hope, forgiveness, changing of ways, redemption…

          • BB123 says:

            @Voice of Reason ; You can’t understand the qualities (or the flow) of any shows on american television (not even The CW) if you see everything in black and white.
            There’s something called “doing the bad thing for the right reason”, and another thing called “being human and making mistakes and bad decisions”.
            And I really don’t think that you can’t understand human being. (but that a hard one, I see life as grey and Human beings still puzzle me).

          • srsly says:

            VoR, apparently you need to pay better attention… Just sayin’. She should never have been allowed back into the country when her spying was revealed. Pre-SB Gibbs would never have forgiven her for her betrayal towards him and the entire team if his actions when Tony and McGee did much, much milder things for good reasons as opposed to her duplicity. Your revising of canon doesn’t make it so, it just shows how deluded you are about what is your fantasy and what was actually presented on your tv.

      • tatiana says:

        You’re aware that this is a tv show right? That cote de pablo has nothing to do with what they write.
        If a tv show has the power to make you feel so bad why watch it?
        I always wondered why people continue watching a show that at the end of the day makes you angry or disappointed?

        • Gabi says:

          @tatiana
          Yes.yes.yes. I wonder the same thing. These people hate her so much? Seriously? If I hated one of the main characters in a tv show, you think I’d keep watching it for 8 years? that doesn’t make ANY sense

          • z has to go. says:

            Gabi, you just said it, she is only one of the main characters and not much of one at that, take out her scenes and you usually don’t miss much. There are also seven other members of the cast, I know it is hard to realize that as we haven’t seen much of them lately but why should I quit watching because I dislike one character?

        • srsly says:

          Cote does not write the episodes. Her character’s expiration date was up 4 seasons ago, however. It’s time for her to move on and find a show where she’s “not the only girl”.

          • Gabi says:

            @srsly
            Wow ok. So you’ve wishing her dead since season 6 and you’re STILL watching? REAL MATURE. -.- just find a new show to watch cause this one’s obviously NOT for you anymore.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @srsly – I once saw Michael Weatherly respond to someone on twitter who tweeted something similar to what you have just said, about hating Ziva and wishing she would die. He was NOT impressed and wondered how someone who calls themselves a fan would wish a main part of the show gone. You people are so out of touch with the reality of the show and what is actually being developed in the storylines. Just give it up already. Also – have you forgotten Pauley!!

          • Gabi says:

            @voiceofreason
            You are on a roll. I again agree 110%. It’s just not right

          • srsly says:

            VoR :coff:, that is not what he said, especially with only 140 spaces. LOL!!!! Get it straight. Besides, what is he going to say, do you suppose?? He is an actor, NCIS is his job. Unlike a certain other cast member, you won’t likely see MW cutting down a costar. I have not forgotten Pauley, Cote has stated in several interviews that she is the only girl and how tough it is for her on set because of that, ignoring that fact that Pauley, as well as several crew members who just so happen to be women, are on set as well. Of course, Cote says a lot of questionable things, so it should come as no surprise. Gabi, I watch despite Ziva’s presence – the ffwd button is a magical device and just shows how inconsequential her character has become when the story works just fine without her shoehorned in scenes. I also have skipped a few episodes, which, btw, have shown ratings drops due to the zivacentric nature of them. Judging other people’s viewing habits and freaking out that someone has a differing opinion is not a sign of maturity either, Gabi. Think about it.

          • Gabi says:

            Wow I’m so beyond tired of this. All your hate for this is not ok. It just doesn’t make sense how you say that you “know” so much about Ziva, and how she’s a bad addition to the show yet you fast forward through ever scene that she’s in as you just said.

          • srsly says:

            Gabi, grow up, stop telling people not to watch, and they aren’t your babies they’re fictional characters. I have only had to resort to the ffwd button this season. Prior to that I *suffered* through her scenes and I have still seen enough to make me laugh or simply boggle in disbelief. The “abba” screech was especially amusing; it reminded me of that Geico flat tire ad. I guess the fact that she had just disowned her father for the second time and couldn’t be bothered to check on him first didn’t factor into that scene. It’s pretty sad when Tony and Tim’s reactions carried much more dramatic weight than the actress’ caterwauling. She’s dead weight. It’s time for her to go.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @srsly – MW did indeed say that on twitter, along with another comment about how amazing Cote’s performances were!! It must irk you to no end to realize such things, and that ALOT of people loved Ziva this year. TVLine gave her acting award of the week for her performance in Shabbat Shalom when her father died, and the episode after that (another Ziva centric one) was the highest rated episode of NCIS ever. For you to say that Cote is dead weight and that her expiry date is up — AND that you thought it was laughable that she would be distraught when her father was murdered — well, it shows how much your fast forwarding of so many scenes in NCIS has affected your understanding of what currently transpires in the show.

          • Gabi says:

            yes. tell em! They need to know. These are pretty much my exact thoughts except I really can’t put them into words quite as nicely as you just did.

          • anna says:

            Voice of reason (lol) and Gabi

            Serious did either of you pay actual attention to shabbot shalom or were you both to enamored of ziva? the woman has disowned her father in nearly every episode Eli David appeared in….her shrillish screech of ABBA was over the top and ridiculous as was the mere idea that she’d be upset considering her final words to him. Add to that the idea that if she’d opened her mouth in the bullpen when she recognized the picture, Eli (& Jackie) would still be alive

            as far as whatever praise she got for the screech and vow for revenge – considering it came from mostly spoiler sites who only focus on ziva (&tiva) for NCIS, no surprise.

            as far as MW and his tweets, he has more class in his little finger and kudos to him for not lowering himself to what cdp has said in interviews about being ‘the only girl in the cast’ and slipping to practically shipping MOTE herself

          • BB123 says:

            Ziva has always had a complicated relationship with her father and has always have been very conflicted about what she feels for him. I was not surprised that she cried for him even after that she said to him. I think she both hated him and loved him, and that’s why it was so difficult for her. That’s why it always have been a struggle.
            NCIS is written with shades of greys. That goes for every characters on the show, and their relationship to their father.
            That make me things, what the heck is TPTB problems with DADS ????

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @anna – people who read what you just wrote here can see yet again how you DO attack actual people, including BOTH Cote, Michael in that particular comment, and elsewhere anyone else who disagrees with your POV. You may try to portray a mature, objective argument to start with, but it doesn’t take long before you reveal that your level of hate/nastiness is not only limited to characters in a tv show, but to the actors who portray them, the writing staff, the showrunner, the fans who disagree with you… need I go on. And you are like a dog with a bone… you just never stop. I am done with this whole topic. I have not posted here before and goodness knows why I started with this particular blog, as I can see that there is point. The arguments you make a circular and you always have to have the last (repeated) word. I just hope you are not this incessantly hateful in other aspects of your life, and are able to actually move on from things that happened years ago.

          • Gabi says:

            Voiceofreason, I’m right with you! I gave up with these rude people yesterday and they just keep on going. It’s irritating.

      • SAM says:

        Funny — a lot of people say that they’ll be done if she doesn’t return. There’s that darn variance of opinion again.

        • anna says:

          thinking it’s probably close to an even number either way, SAM

          • Gabi says:

            I don’t think she’s leaving. She loves the show and the cast and her job. Its what got her going.

          • SAM says:

            I would have said that a couple of years ago. Now? No. I think a significant plurality of people are now for it and enough others won’t mind terribly much if it happens.

          • Gabi says:

            Exactly. Well said

          • Lori says:

            People seem to be judging the number of pro-Tiva and anti-Tiva fans by comments on this article or in response to other articles. I know many people who are fed up with it and do not discuss it online. If you’re judging by Twitter and comments such as this one, you’re likely missing a lot of people. Do not count on this being an accurate accounting who wants what.

      • mez says:

        I’m the one saying seriously. ARE YOU SERIOUS? If a person you like or even love, a person you’re in a romantic relationship with is killed buy a person you also like and trust and work with and put your life in his hands every day when you go to work, wouldn’t you do the same thing? She was furious, she was hurt, she was confused, she was in shock, she had all the right to be all of this and much more. In the end she came to her senses, she understood that what he did needed to be done, she apologized to him on the second episode of season 7 in the bathroom, just in case you missed that scene. Now, put yourself on her shoes and tell me how you would react. Of course you’re not going to do that ever, because you’re a racist, misogynist and xenophobic a**hole who thinks everyone who isn’t born and raised in the US of A, especially someone who is from the middle east, needs to be put down. Well newsflash to you, the rest of the world was already around and civilized for millenniums before your beloved country was found and colonized by people from ALL OVER the globe, so that patriotism of yours doesn’t make any sense, those things you fight so hard to protect don’t really exist, do they? Yeah, that’s what I thought.

        • Gabi says:

          @mez
          You are SO beyond right. they just want to see her as a bad person when obviously she came back because she loves her team and she loves it here. She quit mossad. Like seriously people? Why do gou hate Ziva?

        • Voice of Reason says:

          It does seem that the extreme vitriole that is targetted at Ziva (and Cote on other forums, so I’ve been told) is indeed facist, xenophobic, hateful and totally unwarranted. And I sincerely hope that that hatred which underpins the attitude of some Ziva haters does not infuence TPTB of NCIS at all.

          • srsly says:

            You, dear, are in serious need of a dictionary, and a reality check. BTW, calling yourself the voice of reason does not make it so, it just makes you more laughable when you spew your own foolishness.

          • anna says:

            facist? No. Xenophobic? No. Hateful – fictional character…it is very possible to hate her. unwarranted? definitely not.

            This character has ruined the core canon of NCIS since it needed to be re-written to make her fit into the show (more than once). She’s far past her shelf life and needs to be written off.

            Good luck in your new ventures cdp

          • Gabi says:

            @anna
            If she “ruined the core canon of NCIS” as you say,How come the show has way better ratings since she’s been on? Right.
            And what you said about “having to fit into the show” REALLY? She went to an audition, for a part that she AUTOMATICALLY got. She was more than suited, according to Bellisario people. So no, they didn’t “make her fit”. Actually, the show is doing better with her instead of Kate, who was boring.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            Sorry, I misspelled earlier.. I meant to say Racist… not Facist. I stand by everything else I said. And I believe that if anyone bothers to read through ALL the comments, the facts stand for themselves as to what prompts alot of the hatred thrown at Ziva.

          • Lillian says:

            I know a lot of people who dislike Ziva and don’t think CdP is a good actress. A lot of them. Not once has the subject of her country of origin (for either the character or actress) come up. I never see that on other forums, including TWoP, which someone else mentioned as being negative. Using Racism and Xenophobia is a cheap and unwarranted accusation and stinks of being desperate to put “the other side” down. Before you spout those accusations of insults made, you should confirm them, as opposed to being told by others. I do go to many boards, at least the ones that I’m allowed to visit as guest without having to register, and those claims are unfounded.

          • Gabi says:

            Uhm actually Lillian, If you go through these comments, some insensitive, racist hater posted something about how she should go back to her country. Now, what does that sound like to you? To me, it sounds like racism. So please don’t try to help out these rude people.

          • Alisa Neely says:

            okey, let me be CLEAR: i said ZIVA should go back to her home country….NOT the actress….and i KNOW, i’m the 1 your talking about.

          • Gabi says:

            Doesn’t matter who you were talking about, the character or CdP, it’s still racist.

          • srsly says:

            How is that racist, Gabi??? Explain. Especially when you have no idea what each of our nationalities or origins are. ROTFLOL! This just shows how poor your defense of the character is when it’s all about personal attacks on the posters. Ziva spied on the US, ship her home or send her to Gitmo, I really don’t care.

      • canadian ninja says:

        Referring to Ziva as a Mary Sue is incorrect. Ridiculously incorrect. Keep on hatin :)

        • srsly says:

          Obviously you have no idea what a Mary Sue is then. Ziva tips the mary sue-o-meter.

          • SAM says:

            No, she doesn’t. Go back and read the original definition of the term. Frankly, Captain Kirk is more of a “Marty Stu” as opposed to Ziva being a “Mary Sue.”

          • srsly says:

            SAM, she is a Mary Sue. No question. She is the definition of a Mary Sue.

        • Gabi says:

          Hahhaha, yes try to keep hating cause this is our baby and we will fight for her <3

      • Alisa Neely says:

        very well said……that is MY problem…..ziva was allowed BACK onto TEAM GIBBS, even after WITH HOLDING VITAL information on a case…..that lead to DEAD NCIS agents and an INJURED 1, who was trying to PROTECT his team mate….allowed to get away with holding information in this LAST case….which lead to her father’s MURDER and the wife of the NCIS DIRECTOR…..tony has NEVER been physicially or mentally ABUSIVE towards ziva….the way she has been towards him….he has only ever tried to “honestly” HELP her….and what kind of “thanks” does he get?….ACCUSSED OF MURDER, THROWN TO THE GROUND…..and injured, because she doesn’t know the meaning of the order “STAND DOWN”….given to her by 3 CO’s….GIBBS & TONY…and even vance.

        alisa

        • 4luvofncis says:

          Alisa, you clearly do not understand the depth of this character. Perhaps you should come back in a few years.

          • Pat says:

            Ziva is a pout and pose character. Her tricks include angrily shaking her pony tail, flirting with the camera, wobbling her lower lip (insert eye drops and over act), and her sexy ninja kick butt scenes. She’s a cross between the most vacuous soap opera queen and a cartoon caricature. And this why the quality of the show has plummeted as the stories and other characters are contorted to make this silly shallow thing the central focus.

          • Voice of Truth says:

            I completely agree, Pat. Ziva is as deep as a puddle. I have no idea why the show has focused so much on this irritating creature, but it has alienated a lot of old time fans who have stuck with it in the hope it’ll remember it was once an ensemble and not the Ziva and Gibbs show. Ziva’s main character trait is petulance. She is angry whenever crossed or when she doesn’t get her own way, and has never once learned to control her temper, which often leads to violence. She has killed a suspect in custody, betrayed her team, conducted a revenge killing, and has Gibbs so wrapped around her little finger it makes me wonder what happened to the ‘second b is for bastard’ character we loved so much in the beginning. Gibbs gave Kate a far tougher time for far less. The Gibbs from S1 and 2 would have thrown Ziva off his team years ago. They’ve had to warp all the characters to fit around her because there’s simply no way anyone would tolerate her otherwise.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            Sorry, Alisa, apparently you aren’t the only one.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            Sorry, Alisa, apparently you aren’t the only one. But I understand how the writing & characters of this show can be over some peoples’ heads. Some only see the surface and black & white of things. and that’s not the style of NCIS writers.

          • srsly says:

            What depth? She was a spy – she should have been gone when that was revealed. She played Gibbs – she should have been gone when that was revealed. She attacked Tony, accused him of murder, their to get him thrown off the team, withheld back up…… – she should have been gone. Her “depth” is nonexistent even as her hubris is off the charts. Her character went from requiring suspension of disbelief when she was first introduced to pure disbelief at how many corners she has been written into and then have been handwaved away with no redemption whatsoever. The writers have written her as an unsympathetic, sociopathic super hero with extreme narcissism = the Queen of the Mary Sues and rendered whole episodes as more fantasy than procedural. I find it interesting how her fans paint her as the antithesis of what is presented on the show – transference much? I did LOL at her insistence that she always takes responsibility for her actions – WHEN????? EVER??? ROTFLOL!!! A puddle about sums up her depth and that’s insulting the puddle. I hope CdP doesn’t re-sign – the show would be better off without this character polarizing the fandom and disrupting the story lines. It’s about time NCIS got back to its roots as a military procedural about characters with integrity and humor and not the ongoing, self-generated tragedies of Mossad Mary Sue.

          • Gabi says:

            Is that your ONLY argument? That a few years ago she threw him on the ground and says a few hateful words? Come on get over it. She apologized and she DID mean it. and you obviously don’t understand the relationship that the two are supposed to have. They’re playful, they’re mean. But they also have each other’s back 100%. They also have full trust in each other and tell each other things that they don’t dare tell anyone else. And make small gestures to try and cheer each other up when they’re in a bad mood. And give each other words of advice when needed. We don’t need some long pointless explanation on why she’s “wrong” for him, it’s a tv show.

          • Alisa Neely says:

            once again: ziva ONLY aplogized to tony BECAUSE both abby and GIBBS told her she SHOULD…..and she had to CORNER him in the MEN’S BATHROOM….she still acted as IF it were HIS FAULT and if STILL better then HIM…..and as this last season has PROVED; she still can’t be HONEST and TELL the truth, when it could SAVE LIVES.

          • BB123 says:

            Could you please stop emphaze your word like that ? It look like your shouting at the top of your lung ( a word in capital letters is a code on the internet for shouting).You may or may not have strong argument and good reasoning, but the way you write it isn’t easy to read and make yourself look like an insane woman driven by anger with no control over herself.

          • Gabi says:

            Hahaha thank you! Some people need to calm down on here. I must admit, I got a little heated before with all these people throwing rude comments at Ziva. But I’m so done caring about what Ziva/Tiva haters have to say. She’s made the show better and it shows in ratings. So peace :p Have fun when Tiva becomes canon :))

          • Gabi says:

            Ugh. I’m so done with this. Some of these Ziva haters man, they just can’t see any good sweet old Ziva. Whatever, I’m done caring about what you guys say, you only find the bad in her, and that apology was genuine. So just leave it alone please

          • srsly says:

            Gabi, I gave a number of reasons why she needed to go, including the fact that she played Gibbs and was a SPY. Your answer is ridiculous. they aren’t my ONLY REASON [sic] they are some of the main reasons with plenty of other crap thrown in throughout the years to never make her palatable again. I don’t hate her or wish her dead, I simply want her gone from the show. There’s a huge difference. What would it take for her to cross a line with you or are you so busy drinking the tiva kool-aid that you don’t understand spying on the US and then getting citizenship and a high security clearance job is contradictory to the Nth degree??? That spying and betraying and murdering are not good qualities to be admired? That bullying and harassing and singling out people you allegedly care about is not signs of strength or love but signs of weakness and depravity? The team should have been ARRESTING Ziva, not allowing her to join them. Your love for your ideal of the character is clouding any possibility of logic. i get you’re obviously very young, but grow up. At least you have that “excuse” and option which a lot of other posters do not.

          • Gabi says:

            Damnit just leave me alone! Just stop replying then. Stop. You’re rude and annoying. And you think you know so much about it, I’ve seen the ENTIRE show 3, as in all seasons, for 3 summers now. And you’re the one that said you fast forward through the Ziva scenes so you wouldn’t know squat about what she’s like. So just stop thinking you know everything and stop coming on here writing some long rude paragraph on a character that you don’t even watch. Thanks.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @srsly – I am sorry but it is impossible to take your arguments seriously when you admit to fast forwarding through Ziva scenes. How can you then possibly be expected to understand the progression of her character, or the huge developments that have occurred this season alone. Your incessant recall to S6 shows how outdated your attitude towards Ziva is.

          • Gabi says:

            And they try to say that she’s a spy and she’s a bad person when really, you have no idea what she’s like. Cause they have both changed a significant amount since then. Thanks again voiceofreason

          • BB123 says:

            Don’t mind me, just wanted to point that it amuse me to no end that we can’t take seriously someone who use srsly as an username.

          • Gabi says:

            Hahahahahaha BB123, you’re hilarious!

          • BB123 says:

            Thank you.
            But seriously, I’d never understand people who say “I don’t watch it but I hate it”.

          • Gabi says:

            I know! Like hey, she is such a bad person and she abuses of Tony and she disrespects him, but hey you should also know that I fast forward through every scene that she’s in ??? lol at people. I just think it’s funny.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            @srsly & others: I can’t claim to understand why you feel the way you do nor do I wish to change your opinion. It’s what you think & that’s fine. I also don’t feel the need to provide proof to contradict the questions that you pose, but I will say; the character of Ziva as I understand it, lost her sister to a suicide bombing as a teenager. Her father instilled in her to volunteer for the army & then recruited her into Mossad. “He raised her to be ruthless, soulless killer.” Her father had an affair. Her mother was killed somehow. Her brother, a traitor, killed an American agent & tried to commit terrorist acts. After being asked by her father to “reign him in” & “obtain the trust of NCIS” by betraying her own brother NOT knowing he was a double agent, when she realized he was a traitor she saved Gibbs’ life. She then, on her cognizance, decided to stay at NCIS (obviously her father had to say yes). Then, her father, knowing the connection she’d made w/Michael Rivkin, sent him to the US to USE her as an asset, putting her between Mossad & NCIS, so her father could accomplish his own agenda on US soil. Ziva cared about Michael, but Rivkin was using her. She had allegiances to Mossad, Rivkin, & NCIS. Ziva was wrong about Tony. She was angry that he showed her the truth. When her father demanded she follow through with her mission to infiltrate a terrorist camp by herself, a suicide mission, she realized this. She was tortured & possibly raped, and her father left her there to die. Mossad didn’t even share the information about her surviving the sunken ship w/NCIS. Even thinking she was dead, NCIS, more like Tony, went after Saleem in vengeance. Mossad didn’t even care. But NCIS saved her. She then said I’m done w/my father & Mossad. She chose NCIS as her family. She said she was wrong to both Tony & Gibbs. She said she was sorry. Then, a marine shows up dead. Her father, in anger, then sends her CO to accuse her of murder to force her back to Mossad, knowing that she hadn’t murdered the marine. But after all this, she forgives her father. Then, her father betrays her trust again by killing a reporter because he didn’t want him to screw up his secret plan of peace. Then, he was murdered. Even then Ziva shows a deep grief having lost him. At this point she has lost her ENTIRE blood family. So, how would you expect someone to act in light of all this? How many walls would expect someone to have? How would expect someone to deal with all this trauma & tragedy? Ziva shows incredible strength. Is she sometimes cold & emotionless? She has to be. Have we seen her show emotion & warmth? Um, yes, for certain. Have we seen her let people in? Yes. Is she still immature & a brat? Yes. Who isn’t? Has she shown protectiveness of Tony & Gibbs? Yes. Has she shown affection? Yes. Does she take responsibility for her mistakes? She certainly did for Rivkin & Tony. She certainly did for Adam & shutting Tony out. And as much as people want to argue this, she didn’t have the intention of taking Bodnar’s life. She wanted him to stand trial. And then resigned to take responsibility for her breaking-protocol/going-against-orders-Bodnar actions. We still have yet to see those consequences. How much depth would a character have to maintain to carry all of these burdens & still maintain relationships & to be considered valuable & functioning agent, someone’s daughter, someone’s best friend, & someone’s partner, and not crumble & break & fall & disintegrate under all its weight ? You tell me.

          • Gabi says:

            @4luvofncis
            You, my friend, understand the depth and the character of the great Ziva David. And you explained it all beautifully <3 props.

          • anna says:

            4luvof ncis….

            there are parts of ziva’s backstory/family you appear to have wrong. her father did push her to volunteer for the Israeli army. Service is required of all (males & females). Boo hoo, daddy suddenly had an affair….considering that Ari was ziva’s 1/2 brother, not her full brother it appears to not be a big deal that he also had an affair with Orli. Ziva’s mother originally took the kids away from Eli because she didn’t want them exposed to the danger (obviously didn’t work depending on when Tali was killed)

            Eli did not raise ziva to be a killer…from all that we’ve heard about her childhood, it was privileged, complete with dance lessons and judging from how she told the story of the her father, her uncle (aunt?) and that pony, she was bordering on a spoiled brat.

            The story of Ari’s death is currently up for discussion. Either ziva was Ari’s handler and helped prepare dossiers on Team Gibbs before Kate was killed and only saw Ari as a rogue double agent when it became necessary for her to kill him to save Gibbs OR she was sent to the US to murder her 1/2 brother as a way to gain the trust of Gibbs – why, who knows….

            As far as the Rivkin debacle goes, considering that Rivkin was sent to kill a few people in the US, it’s completely understandable that Eli would have Rivkin use ziva as a cover considering ziva worked for Mossad at the time….no question here – he didn’t unfairly use his daughter. she was an agent for mossad at that point in time.

            As far as Somalia goes, can’t claim rape since we don’t know that…yes, the team went to avenge her death – nothing they didn’t do for Kate or Paula or Jenny. Mossad presence was definite as noted by Chad from Chad when he reported to Gibbs via MTAC.

            Now as far as I’d expect ziva to act after this? I’d expect ziva to get her butt in therapy, take a leave of absence from her job or consider a new career. Get some serious psychiatric help and stay the heck away from pursuing a relationship with anyone until she works on her very obvious issues.

          • BB123 says:

            Anna, I agree that Ziva should need huge therapy. And that is true for every member of this team. However it was canonly said that the only way they remain sane is that they are a close family.
            So, in canon, if Ziva is at least remontly sane and want to stay the same way, and even heal, then she has to stay in the team.
            We can disagree all we want, but the show (and so TPTB) had tell us it’s how it was. There’s no interpretation, no nothing.
            Ziva is sane thanks to the team and has to stay, and that, my friends, is canon.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            anna, as you will see, i did say her father “pushed her” to use your words, “instilled in her” my words, to be in the army. and correct me if i’m wrong, are you saying Ari had an affair w/Orli? because that’s incorrect. “he raised you to be a ruthless, soulless killer” is a direct quote from ncis. spoiled brat? wow. just, WOW. boy do we set our standards low. like i said, the Ari storyline was resolved in Reunion. Sounds like you don’t believe the writing. can’t help you there. Rivkin: So is that why her father didn’t involve her in the operation? because she was Mossad & she should expect to be kept in the dark by her own “team,” let alone father? that she expect the Mossad director, aka her father, to send someone to play on her feelings, use her for sex, use her for information, & use her connection to NCIS against her? Somalia: you have your timeline off on Chad in MTAC. He was referring to the Mossad presence when Ziva’s team was there/talking about a female being captured. This was May. So, no, Mossad was no longer involved after Ziva went in by herself, and she was left there. And, the only reason NCIS went after Saleem, is because first Tony started looking for Ziva, thought she was dead, and then said, “No. no. We have an obligation. Saleem Ulman’s gotta be stopped, before one more person dies.” The rape possibility is strongly alluded to in Patriot Down & in Freedom.

          • Lillian says:

            @4luv. In Israel it’s mandatory to serve 2 years in the IDF, Israel Defense Forces. Eli didn’t have to push her into it, her country did. Just to clear that up. The “raised her to be a ruthless killer” has always been a bone of contention for me because her rare, but revealing anecdotes show otherwise. I blame the writers but mostly SB for that lack of continuity and the turning of Ziva into a one-dimensional character. DPB’s Ziva was more nuanced and well-rounded. I liked early Ziva. I don’t like the Ziva from Legend on. Thanks SB, you turned a huge number of fans against a main character.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            Oh well I guess I’m just going by the dialogue in Kill Ari II when she said she volunteered? And I was making the inference based on the other writing that her father instilled it in her to do so. Yes I agree that the black n white of “ruthless soulless killer” doesn’t match up point for point w/Ziva’s character, but at the same time, it could still be true that it was her father’s unconscious or conscious intention to raise her this way, and at least to be an assassin, & she ended up being different than this even before Aliyah/T or C. but when she says “i only had death in my heart,” that pretty much defines a ruthless, soulless killer . i guess i don’t see her in any way being one dimensional. i’ve seen a spectrum of emotions and layers to her character & personality & significant development.

          • Lillian says:

            Okay, you’re mixing things up. First you say that her father “instilled” her to join the army, now you’re talking about her killing Ari? Those are two separate issues. Her father’s insistence on putting a hit on Ari pushed her to volunteer for the assignment, yes. Her father had nothing to do with her joining the Army.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            that’s not what i said. killing Ari had nothing to do with what i just stated. i was talking about episode called “Kill Ari II.” i’m talking about the army/IDF. from what i remember when she & tony were talking outside the rec center, she said she volunteered. whether or not that is accurate according to reality is not the issue. and i was saying my perception based on all the episodes taken as a whole through season 8, in hindsight, is that her father had something to do with that.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            and yes, i agree that she pushed to volunteer to be Ari’s handler in the Season 3 episodes so she could protect him/find out the truth. and i don’t believe it was a simple as her father “put a hit out on Ari.” from what i understand, Ziva was to take necessary action (killing him) SHOULD it be determined he was a rogue agent/going against Mossad, and that also served the purpose of gaining the trust of NCIS/Gibbs. which she later stated she wouldn’t have done even if ordered to if Gibbs life wasn’t in danger.

      • Erin says:

        Bravo srsly – I agree 100%. The show has gone from a rich, clever, original dramedy – to As the Bullpen Turns – the tragedies and dramas of princess Mary Sue Ziva , her tragic adopted daddy, and the poor idiot her adores her abuse.

        • Gabi says:

          Oh my God, PEOPLE. The show doesn’t revolve around Ziva, this season just happened to be a little bit more focused on her and you guys hate one her for it? That’s not cool, and that’s the WRITER’S choice! If you hate her so much on the show, what reason do you have to watch it? She’s a friggin main character!! How do you watch tv show in which you hate one of the main characters who btw, has been on for 8 years? That’s idiotic and self-abusive. Honestly, so maybe you guys should rethink your reasons for watching.

          • anna says:

            How do you watch? Easy – DVR it and then watch it with finger poised on the FF button. I’ve found that not watching most of the ziva scenes make the episodes much more enjoyable and I don’t miss a thing – that’s how useless a character she is…

            oh wait – I did watch one scene of hers. Her ridiculous caterwailing ‘Abba’…it was funny as anything

            Like as been said before – ziva is as deep as a puddle

          • Gabi says:

            @anna
            I think you need a happy meal, cause all you seem to do on here is verbalize how much you hate Ziva. Wtf did she do to you? Damnit why do you have to be so rude about it? And no, I watch LIVE, you know, like a true fan of the show who also doesn’t pick on all the things that Ziva does and despise her for it. Laughing at the character when she realises her dad’s dead? Wow I didn’t know people could be so insensitive.

          • BB123 says:

            Anna, you can’t say anything against Ziva, her behavior and her character development if you don’t watch her scene at all. It’s ridiculous to criticize something you don’t watch

          • Gabi says:

            BB123, thanks or catching that, that is quite contradictory, isn’t it?

          • BB123 says:

            Thank You.
            I hate people who judge without knowing. Not watching means you don’t know what’s going on. How can you tell you don’t like something you don’t know ?
            I never watch Dexter. I just can say that I don’t like murderer (and villains) as main character. But I would never ever say that I hate Dexter Morgan and I don’t know him since I don’t watch his adventure.
            That Being said, I can understand not liking a character, any character on this show. They all have flaws and shortcomings that don’t always agree with some people. Sometimes you love a character dispite this flaws (or because of them), sometimes they’re not something you can tolerate. But that is very personnel. As for myself, I can’t stand negative people that only see the bad in everything. A character like that on TV as a sure way to being dislike by me, even if the character as strong qualities I would love otherwise. So I could understand not liking Ziva, Tony, Gibbs, or any of the characters on NCIS because one or more of her flaws rub someone the wrong way.
            But there’s no need to be rude about it and insult people and even the actress !

          • Gabi says:

            BB123, I agree. Personally I LOVE everyone on the show, but that’s just me. But seeing how much hate some people have for the characters, ahhh it makes me sad. But idc if you don’t like it, just don’t be rude about it!

          • Voice of Reason says:

            Oh Anna – I can not believe you actually admitted to that about you thinking it was hilarious when Ziva was so distraught when her father died, although it comes as no surprise to me that you think it! Once again you are showing your true colors, my dear. Why do you let a show upset you so much? It is not healthy — you really do need to move in.

          • Gabi says:

            @voiceofreason
            Right again. She is a really rude person and the things she says are really hurtful and I hope cote never comes across these.

          • Voice of Truth says:

            Gabi – Cote is a grown woman, not a little girl like you. She wouldn’t last five minutes in her profession if she couldn’t handle people not liking the character she plays or her public persona. She knows the truth of her private interactions far better than outside observers so I’m sure if she’s well loved onset, with lots of friends, and hangs out with MW all the time that anyone implying anything different on a spoiler site really wouldn’t bother her.

            She said herself in one interview that her family joke she’s got skin like pig’s leather so I’d assume she’s not a wilting flower. She gets paid a hefty paycheck – more in a year than most people will earn in a lifetime – for doing her job and criticism comes with the territory. She’s not you so stop emoting on her behalf.

            I note you don’t give much of a damn about any of the negative comments about MW or Tony – in fact, none of the Tiva fans have stood up for the actor or character in the comments against them both, but the minute someone says something negative about Ziva or Cote, you go into a collective meltdown. As always with Tiva fans, it’s ALL about Cote and Ziva, and Tony/MW is just there to facilitate the great Tiva yawn. The great split remains – Tiva fans are ZIVA fans, and the reason there are so many fights is that a lot of fans who count Tony as their favorite character can’t stand the way she treats him. You want him with her, we want him as far away from her as possible.

          • BB123 says:

            Please, have the respect to not consider the view of One Tiva Fan as the whole.
            I am a Tiva fan, and I more a fan of Tony than Ziva !
            I find Tony backstory more interesting, more subtle and the character more charming than Ziva. However I can admit that Tony is far from perfect either, than both have Strong issues on their own. If being a fan of Tony denying that the guy can be a bully (especially to Tim), then I am no longer a fan. Tony can act immature too, as seen multiple time. With good reason, but he is. As I already said, that’s why I like the character because he is that way.
            Ziva, I like her too, because she is complicated, there’s a paradox between the unmotionnel soldier she wants to be and how she react emotionnally, a conflict that I find interesting. i like their banter, how they pick on each other. And Tony can be as harsh as Ziva in his jokes.
            And to be totally honest, I find all of the characters too harsh on each other sometimes. The writers give all of them moments where they are insensitive instead of funny. I tend to notice it from all the characters.
            Some Anti-Tiva/Tony fans seems to see it only one, only when its Ziva who is harsh. What about McGee who cast Tony away from his ticket broker thing ? That upseted me even if I can see McGee reasonning.
            Or what about when Both Ziva and Tony teams up against McGee ? Most of the time, it’s fun, sometimes, they BOTH cross a line IMO.

          • Alisa Neely says:

            am i to guess that Cote handles the fans NOT liking her character BETTER, then the actress who plays Catherine on Hawaii Five 0 ?…..because that actress is beyound RUDE and childish…..attacking the fans…..telling her followers/fans to “un-follow” their folowers and such…..and just to be clear: this DOESN’T make me WANT ziva still on the show….as i DON’T want catherine on H 5-0 …..can’t stand EITHER character.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            … move *on* (not in). Sorry for the typos.

          • Daniel says:

            Ahh, Anna–wow, your fan girl obsession is rearing it’s ugly little head. Maybe if mean old Ziva is gone Tony will come for you? Go back on your meds sweetie, you are truly embarrassing yourself. Either that or you are only 12 and this is your first TV crush. Wow…..

          • anna says:

            Gabi quite honestly your own rudeness is coming thru with your ‘true fan’ garbage….I was answering your question of how does one watch a tv show when one doesn’t like a character….maybe you should have read the post you made that I was responding to before you go off raging and ranting

          • Gabi says:

            Anna.
            I AM a true fan. I have SOOO much love for Cote and Michael and their characters. Unlike yourself. So it hurts me when you say such rude and disrespectful things about 2 of my very favorite celebrities. I wasn’t TRYING to be rude. It just hurts.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @Daniel – I hear you!! Glad to see more and more people are noticing and bothering to comment.

    • JC says:

      Personally I much prefer how Castle has handled the relationship (well up until the last three episodes anyway) to what Chuck did. I loved Chuck and Sarah as a couple, but the show spent too much time in my opinion on couple-issues/relationship drama after getting the two of them together. I would much have preferred a return to focusing on the quirky spy show stuff and put the Chuck & Sarah drama to rest. Castle in my opinion has done it right, and I’ve been totally bewildered by the constant complaining from the Caskett shippers this year, because it’s everything I would have wanted, save possibly for more Martha and Alexis.

  10. Mary says:

    I would LOVE it if Tiva really happened. I definitely don’t want it to take over the show, but haven’t they been through enough without being an official couple anyways? They obviously made it out stronger. In today’s society, where the divorce rate is 50%, I really think Tiva would be part of the 50% who stay together. It wouldn’t be something out of the realm of possibility, and in moderation it definitely wouldn’t ruin the show. We all love Undercovers, Jetlag and other Tiva-heavy episodes (go Berlin!). In other words, BRING ON THE TIVA!

    • anna says:

      No Mary we do not ALL love Undercovers, Jetlag, Berlin & any other Tiva-heavy episode. There are many fans out there who hate them all & do not watch repeats of them because the Tiva episodes tend to write Tony as nothing more than part of a pairing & Ziva’s toy.

      Tiva was ‘friend-zoned’ to a certain extent & quite honestly, there was way more chemistry in the (most likely adlibbed) kiss between Tony & McGee than there was between Tony & Ziva.

      • SAM says:

        In your opinion. But you know Anna, not everybody hates Ziva and the actress who portrays her the way you do either. Most people like the character and di Pablo too.

    • Andrea says:

      Mary, with all due respect, you do not represent “we.’ You represent “you. I can’t stand Tony and Ziva as a couple or Ziva as a character, quite frankly. If it were up to me, “Tiva” would be non-existent, but since that’s not likely to happen (because even I expect Cote to sign another contract), the season finale was terrific for me. Tony and Ziva can (and should be) friends since the entire team cares for one another, but that’s enough. I’m tired of being told that Tony and Ziva have a “special” sort of anything. In my opinion, they are no more “special” to each other than any other member of the team. If they were simply friends to the end of time, I’d be thrilled, and I think that goes back to Dee’s question to Matt. Unlike many TV couples, there is a strong contingent of the NCIS viewership that does NOT want Tony and Ziva to ever be a couple.

      • SAM says:

        And there is an equally strong contingent that do want them to be a couple, which gets to the heart of what Matt was talking about.

        • anna says:

          which means, if TPTB don’t want to lose their stellar ratings, that you’re are stuck with the push/pull of more anvils and no canon relationship SAM….IF they actually re-sign cdp of course

          • SAM says:

            Well Anna, I think it’s pretty much canon that they have deep feelings for each other. And I think the only people who complain about “anvils” are people like you who don’t even believe the relationship exists. Personally, I think the show will get along just fine if they put them together. As for re-signing di Pablo — could be they have already done so and are just hammering out the actual wording of the contract, dotting “i’s” and crossing “t’s”.

          • srsly says:

            Just your opinion, Sam, not shared by everyone or even the majority you keep suggesting.

      • Alisa Neely says:

        i agree…..i’m SICK of some fans acting as IF they speak for ALL fans……i and MANY others DON’T love ziva/tiva or code…..we are SICK of having this ABUSIVE relationship FORCED onto us….HOW any “ton fan” could EVER want him in a relationship, with someone who has 0 RESPECT for him as their SFA….who will throw their injured partner to the ground, and WISH them DEAD…..and so many other things…..i don’t know…..i couldn’t call myself a “tony fan”, if that was the type of relationship i wanted for him….and i DON’T…..when ever tony is “team paired” with ziva, he made to look WEAK and make her look GOOD……i have NO problem with a “strong female character”……however, a “strong male character” shouldn’t have to be weakened to show that…..covering your partner’s back….doesn’t mean, that partner CAN’T take care of themselves…..however, that is HOW tptb write tony….and we are SICK of it….along with ziva being allowed to HIDE information…..yet when tony let it be known he HAD to with hold inforation because the DIRECTOR ordered him to….he was treated like CRAP….even by GIBBS…..who’d worked ALOT of UC cases.

        alisa

        • Voice of Reason says:

          You included Cote in your list of things you hate about the show… which is very sad. I am sure you never meant to let people see that particular card in your hand, but there it is!

          • anna says:

            lol…voice of unreasonability, it’s perfectly ok to not like an actress, you know….it’s been happening for years….

            There are fans on IMDB who can’t stand RJ for one reason or another….some don’t like MW….the list goes on….

            It’s rather amusing that you & Gabi are flipping out over dislike over a fictional character and the actress who plays her. Chill – it’s a TV SHOW. No need to take it personally….unless you’re cdp of course….

          • Gabi says:

            We take offense because we full heartedly love this show and everyone on it. And you bashing on Cote is not cool and we don’t appreciate it. That’s all.

          • anna says:

            gabi…let’s go over this again – not liking an actress because of her acting ‘skill’ is perfectly natural and normal…got it/

    • Gabi says:

      Thank you Mary! These 2 are stronger than ever, and they have full trust in each other and they love each other so very much. They just click and they are too cute. And those looks! Ah the Tiva looks make me melt <3

      • anna says:

        obviously you’ve never examined MW as Tony’s body language when he has to play tiva

        • SAM says:

          Anna, I personally know a couple of people who got to see some of the filming for some of the scenes in “Double Blind”. They got to see both Weatherly and de Pablo interact between filming. They said that to even suggest that the two don’t get along is ludicrous. They get along quite nicely, thank you very much.

          • Lillian says:

            @SAM: I personally went to the set as well during another episode and while the other actors were out, intermingling, Cote stayed hidden somewhere. There was no one bugging her for pictures or autographs, either.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @Lillian – perhaps she was hiding from you ;-) (said in jest)

          • Gabi says:

            LMAO, that’s fuuuuunny :)

          • BB123 says:

            LOL
            I’ll be a wild one and guess that maybe, she was learning her lines !!

          • Lillian says:

            She didn’t have many lines in that scene, are you saying she’s not very smart?

          • BB123 says:

            If knowing or not your lines is sign of intelligence then actors are stupids. And we enjoy it wiith gag reel and bloopers.
            So Yeah for stupid actors !

          • 4luvofncis says:

            @Lillian: Please explain how Cote not mingling equates to her not getting along with Michael.

          • anna says:

            let’s see….it’s announced to the cast that there are visitors on set (for what purpose considering it’s the finale arc, who knows but the idiocy of that is for another discussion)…so let’s see, that means the cast A) plays nice and shows their happy family public image or B) let’s their normal disagreements and whatever passes for a day of work show to the fans who have come to squee over them…such a HARD decision for them because it’s so obvious….

          • 4luvofncis says:

            I’m not really following this line of thought. How in the world can ANYone know why a cast member wouldn’t be available during a set visit? This is all conjecture & really not worth debating further.

          • Yes, I remember our friends telling us all about the filming for that episode, SAM! And the pictures they shared from behind the scenes clearly showed Michael, Cote, Sean and Mark hanging out and laughing. You can tell they are very close. :-)

    • Voice of Truth says:

      Honestly, I thought Jetlag was drivel, even leaving aside the Tiva quotient – it was just a really poorly written episode. Undercovers was amusing in places but hardly a classic. I couldn’t bring myself to watch Berlin but someone quoted to me some truly nauseating line about Ziva hanging up her man’s clothes. Seriously? What century are we in and since when has Ziva been about clearing up after a man? Hideous. My favorite episodes are ones like SWAK, Twilight, Bait, Call of Silence, Bloodbath, Requiem, Baltimore and Chained.

      • anna says:

        There’s a reason why many fans refer to JETLAG as JETGAG….it was beyond drivel. It was one of the dumbest storylines ever written by an NCIS writer

        • SAM says:

          Second only to “Obsession”, which got more negative comments and did far worse in the ratings that season.

          • Lillian says:

            No one appreciated the film noir feel to Obsession, which is a shame. It was wonderful. Of course the Tiva fans would hate it, because Tony was interested in someone else.

          • BB123 says:

            Actually about the noir I am not sure that ships is to blame. Castle had a noire episode too (and I loved it) that were big in shipping moments but it wasn’t well received (a shame too) People doesn’t seems to respond well to that feel.

  11. BB123 says:

    Follow-up Comment/question about NCIS.
    I understand that you wrote about the “recipe” and I can understand why they won’t give closure to Tiva fans yet. However reading the comments in this very website, It seems to me that viewers and fans are more angry that showrunners “promise” things that never happen than the fact;
    I know that showrunners never promise anything, they just “tease” and say this or that. But I do think they know as much as I know how fans reads into this teases.
    Do you think it’s still a good idea to keep teasing Tiva when they know they won’t go all-in with them ?

    • Matt Webb Mitovich says:

      I hear what you are saying, but let’s remember, it was a cast member who “promised” “The Year of Tiva.” Gary is always carefully measured in what he teases on that front.

      • Wanda says:

        Then perhaps Mr. G should keep his mouth shut, from hence forward?? He stinks at teasing…CLEARLY. It’s awful to get fans’ hopes up by promising them something huge, if he’s only going to lie about it, right? I will say that those two episodes in which Ziva’s father got killed & the one after that were the best of NCIS that I’ve ever seen.

        • anna says:

          He didn’t lie, Wanda….the tiva fans got a ‘year of tiva’ throughout Season 10. It isn’t GG’s or MW’s fault that what they gave wasn’t enough to satisfy fans who immediately interpret something to the extreme, forgetting that the show has to measure what they give out to not lose viewers.

          It’s not the show that needs to keep their mouths shut. It’s the fans who have to be more realistic in what they expect rather than reading every tiva spoiler with a ‘oh this is the year we get canon Tiva and any who don’t like the pairing can just go away’ type attitude.

      • Mel says:

        But I seriously doubt that Mr. Weatherly, who has been very vocal about *not* wanting Tiva, would have promoted the Year of Tiva if the show had not told him to. This way Gary skates and has one of the actors take the fall for a tease not fulfilled. Not quite fair.

        • 4luvofncis says:

          This is not conclusive.Nor is it clear. Rarely is he literal or serious in interviews. He has also been very supportive of “TIVA.” Or rather, the work he & Cote specifically have put into their characters & on screen relationship.

          • anna says:

            don’t see how much clearer he could have made it….
            it’s rather amusing though – when he’s for TIVA, the shipper fans love him and say what a great guy he is. When he puts out an interview like the Buzzfeed one, they trash him on his twitter feed, say vile things about him and his family or take the road you’ve taken and claim it’s a joke….

          • Gabi says:

            Uhm idk about you. But NO ONE on tumblr trash talks Gary. Actually quite the opposite. We worship him. He’s genius wether or not there’s Tiva. Soo… nahhh

          • 4luvofncis says:

            i think it’s amusing too, anna, when it appears he is “anti-tiva” (in that perspective) that anti-shippers love him and say what a reasonable guy he is, but then when he does things that appear to be in support of it, they dismiss it as “the company line” & it’s really not how he personally feels. yep, it’s clear as mud.

      • Yes, Michael did indeed say it was ‘The Year of TIVA’ prior to the Season 10 premiere, which had those of us that are TIVA fans excited about this season. And Gary is not the only showrunner to tease TIVA…..Shane Brennan did that as well as Donald Bellisario, the orginial showrunner who was the one that hired Cote and he saw the chemistry between Michael and Cote and decided to play on that strength. So this TIVA tease has been going on for 8 years now. At some point, they need to follow through or back off. Personally, they should put Tony and Ziva together, because I have confidence that it’ll be written right and won’t overwhelm the episode. Let’s not forget that this is an ensemble cast, so each week will usually be focused on a team member or team members, not just Tony and Ziva. That’s one of the reasons why I love NCIS, how the team interacts and their character strengths/weaknesses. I hope Season 11 will be the season that has Tony and Ziva in a relationship or taking steps to be in one.

        Thank you, Matt, for taking the time to answer our questions about NCIS and various characters, and for the time you’re taking to respond to several comments. Very much appreciated. :-)

        • anna says:

          Written right? There hasn’t been a tiva episode yet that was written correctly. Everytime Tiva fans are given glimpses of their pairing every character – including Tony – takes a backseat to ziva & tiva.

          • Pat says:

            The show is all about the romance and melodrama of super tragic Ziva. I can’t stand this Mary Sue character. The show’s revolving around her over done cartoon caricature has truly ruined the show. Tony has been reduced to team butt monkey and Ziva’s personal cheerleader.

          • You’re just upset that Ziva is still on the show after 8 seasons. Guess what, she’s one of the main draws of NCIS and she’s 3rd billing. And the other characters do not take a backseat to Ziva or TIVA. One of the most superbly written episodes from Season 10 and overall is Shiva and it became the 1st NCIS episode to surpass the 25 million viewers mark with L+3 ratings. Michael and Cote were absolutely amazing in this episode and Cote even received the ‘Best Performer of the Week’ by TVLine for her work on ‘Shabbat Shalom’ the week before and NCIS got kudos for such a brilliantly executed episode with Shiva. I could go on and on about Michael and Cote’s awesome work from the 8 seasons they’ve worked together and with Mark, Sean, Pauley, David, Rocky and Brian, but I’ll just let it be known that the cast loves working together, and they have stated it time and time again. :-)

          • Erin says:

            There were lots of “tiva” moments shoehorned in this season, but to me, it was really the year of Ziva. She was inserted significantly into everything and had an arc that lasted half the season and sadly may not be done yet. If CdP re-signs, I hope next season will be Ziva lite, just like this season was Abby, Tony, Tim, and Ducky lite. I can’t take another Ziva dramafest.

          • SAM says:

            Again, strictly your opinion Anna.

          • no anna just no says:

            Like the season 7 premiere? Boy that was one hell of a backseat for Tony.

      • BB123 says:

        Thanks for the answer.

      • mimi says:

        Sorry, Matt. But that cast member was promoting what his tptb told him to promote. It’s his job to promote what tptb want for the (in this case) upcoming season so, though *he* said those words, he was just working and not expressing his own ideas… a thing that he clearly did last month. You should know this better than anyone of us.

        • 4luvofncis says:

          How do you know for certain? have you talked to MW? and by that token, when is he NOT working & expressing his own ideas? do you have some inside track as to when MW is spouting the “company line” as you say & when he’s expressing his real feelings? Or are you just guessing & interpreting like the rest of us?

          • anna says:

            guess you’ve never read comments by those 2 publicists how they’re on set or with the actors when they do interviews….

          • 4luvofncis says:

            i don’t have any idea what you’re referring to or how it’s relevant. what comments & by what publicists? and when?

          • mimi says:

            Don’t need to talk to MW. Just need to notice that, when he was promoting the show with another cast member or with GG, he says ‘this is the year of tiva’, but as soon as he’s promoting alone or doing alone-interviews he says that ”put Tony and Ziva together would be a disaster for the show” (interview about 100th episode), I guess because he still remember the Logan/Max’s disaster on Dark Angel.
            And more, HE twitted the link for the buzzfeed interview (that pi**ed off some tiva fans to the point that some of them even bashed and insulted him, his wife, their daughter and the baby they’re expecting – GAG!) so, unless you think that he’s completely crazy and completely stupid and twitts link false interview, that is what HE thinks… and I find really interesting the time that interview was released and re-twitted: just after the most soap-operish episode of NCIS written with the sole intent of having as much tiva (imo fake) romance as possible (writers’ words).
            I do not need to know Michael personally or to talk to him, I just look at the facts.

            Unfortunately, all of this doesn’t mean that tiva will never happen *sigh*
            PP, MW, BD, RC have been really clear about what they think about ships among the main characters (a big ‘no’) and even a man of a few words like MH sounded against it too, when he said “I don’t think Tony and Ziva will dance the horizontal tango”, but it’s not what actors want or think what really happens on the show (except maybe for MH, the exec. prod.) in the end.

            What CBS wants is what we get and they based their decisions on, first of all the ratings and later on fans’ desires.
            For the most part of SX, NCIS needed DVR to have 20 or more million viewers while in S9 they just needed the Tuesday ratings.
            If we make a comparison between the last five episodes of S9 and the last 5 episodes of S10, only ‘Revenge’ did better than S9 episodes (likely because people wanted to see the aftermaths of the car crash). IMO this is a sign that this last promoted-for-months SF arc, packed with blind revenge, Federal Agents going against laws and tiva, didn’t work as well as tptb thought. In fact I’ve read more bad reviews than good ones and from all kind of fans (not only anti-ships or no-Ziva).
            And they can’t even blame ‘The Voice’ for this low ratings, because YBWO, that had very short promotion and was aired during Christmas time (when rantings usually go down) and against ‘The Voice’ Finale, did better than 13 episodes of SX and definitely better than the last six episodes of the season.

            Time to re-think the show priorities and maybe to get back the drama show and ALL of its characters? It’s all in CBS and writers’ hands now…

          • 4luvofncis says:

            No, Mimi, it isn’t fact. It is your interpretation, your opinion, your inference, your belief, your perception, your summation & your drawing of conclusions based on what you see or hear or read. also, that interview was done during filming of the finale. also, if you were his co-star, how would you feel about this interview if it was to be taken literal? i don’t know about you, but i would be pissed. but, i don’t see Cote being pissed at Michael. also, what is fact, is that MW’s media rep, who knows him quite well, better than you or i, stated it wasn’t to be taken literal. and, as you pointed out, it doesn’t really make a difference. so why, i wonder, do people keep bringing it up & using it as ammunition to support their “perception” that Tony & Ziva don’t or shouldn’t or won’t have a romance?

          • srsly says:

            Ah yes, the media rep. You mean Kristin and/or Katie, who worried more about #Tiva trending than #NCIS?? The ones who attacked fans who didn’t toe the tiva line? The one who apparently don’t get or don’t care that their social media presence reflects poorly upon themselves and the show they supposedly are representing? The ones who dismissed MW’s interview along with other comments through the years as jokes? Do you seriously believe his entire interview was just a huge joke? Then the joke is on you! The ones who never tweet about anything but tiva, ziva and cote? Mark Harmon receives an award = silence. How about Chas’ recent huge award = nothing. They have shown their true colors repeatedly. They have an agenda which is not in the show and its cast’s best interests. How they both still have their jobs is beyond me. Anything they say is immediately suspect.

          • Matt Webb Mitovich says:

            Careful now. Consider this a warning.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            Again, your perception & as I gather probably not all truth and not all knowing, which is bordering on slander & darn right accusatory. So I am glad Matt spoke up.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            Yes, of course. Voice away. I never said it wasn’t. I was simply using the same language to describe the initiation of this “debate.”

        • Matt Webb Mitovich says:

          I am not casting any aspersion on the source, just making sure everyone remembers that it was not the showrunner using the specific “Year of Tiva” promise.

          • srsly says:

            You don’t need to cast aspersions, the tivas will happily do that for you. It’s like a compulsion for them…

          • 4luvofncis says:

            As it is a compulsion for others to respond in opposition to every single post of those in favor of seeing Tony & Ziva get together.

          • srsly says:

            Are we not entitled to voice our opinion as well?

          • 4luvofncis says:

            Yes, of course. Voice away. I never said it wasn’t. I was simply using the same language to describe the initiation of this “debate.”

      • OneOldLadysOpinion says:

        Do any of you remember Bellsarious last block buster TV show actually where NCIS got it’s start “JAG” well if you do or for those of you who don’t we “the audience” were teased un mercifully about a Harm & Mac relationship & in that case it was & always had been obvious that there was “something” between them, ie. as in Castle & Beckett, this thing with Tony & Ziva is a non-starter as I see it—I’ve watched every episode of all three shows—I think it was all in the fans mind not the show runners—though yes they may tease—& why would we want them to be together they have nothing in common for the most part & if they DID get together that would pretty much mean that one or the other would have to leave the team! If they EVER do it should be as in the series finale of JAG with Harm & Mac! OneOldLadysOpinion

        • 4luvofncis says:

          Just a quick comment; these are fictional characters & script, regardless of rule 12, like they have with other rules, and rule 12 as well, they can be broken, or rewritten, or an exception made, or Tony/Ziva just get engaged & bypass dating, or she gets pregnant, or Gibbs is gone for a year, or Gibbs eliminates the rule, or etc, etc, etc. Just because rule 12 currently exists does not mean if Tony & Ziva are officially romantically together that one of them would have to leave the team.

          • anna says:

            actually I believe from research, it’s an NCIS policy – much like it is with most police departments. Know it’s fiction and all that, but considering how they’ve pretty much destroyed credibility as far as they’re sticking to the real agency, they’d at least want to not push it that far

          • 4luvofncis says:

            um, actually anna, if you’ve watched the episodes in season 8, you’ll realize that it ISN’T an NCIS policy, that it IS about being Gibbs’ rule #12, in addition, there are married NCIS agents that work together in real life.

          • Anna, did you forget that a previous NCIS director was married to an NCIS agent? And that was one of the goals Donald Bellisario wanted to explore was to see how a couple could make a personal and professional relationship. He said it on the Season 1 DVDs and I think he was going to try that with Tony and Kate, then Sasha decided to leave at the end of Season 2. That’s the beauty of fictional TV versus real life. Of course, it makes sense that a married couple can’t be on the same team within NCIS or other agencies, but nothing in the rules says they can’t work for the same agency, business, etc.

          • anna says:

            it’s an NCIS policy (& an LEO one) that they can’t be ON THE SAME team folks…so bye-bye team if you want tiva

          • Anna, the rules in real life doesn’t apply on TV….that’s the beauty of TV, because it’s a fictional setting that allows the showrunner and writers a bit more flexibility to create the characters and their stories! You might want to watch your Season 1 DVDs again to listen to Donald P. Bellisario talk about how he wanted to explore how a couple could manage a personal and professional relationship after meeting a real life NCIS Director who was married to an NCIS agent. I believe DPB was going to try this with Tony and Kate, then Sasha Alexander left the show. And then of course, Cote de Pablo came on board to play Ziva David and the rest is history. :-)

          • L. Burke says:

            Yeah, they would. No, it is about policy. Ziva is in Tony’s DIRECT chain of command. It goes SAC (Senior Agent in Charge)- Gibbs. SFA (Senior Field Agent) and 2IC Tony. Next would be Special Agent McGee with rank that comes from seniority. And THEN Ziva at the bottom of the chain. Ziva reports up DIRECTLY through Tony up to Gibbs. Tony does things like writer her evals. Hence they could NOT serve together on the same team if they were involved. It’s about policy and not just Rule 12. And No Tony never broke any policies with EJ. Tony did NOT report up through her direct chain of command. EJ for example would not be writing his field evals. I just don’t understand why some fans can’t grasp Tony IS technically Ziva’s boss.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            According to NCIS, the show, not the real world, “It’s not against NCIS policy to date co-workers.” Taken from Two-Faced. “NCIS doesn’t have a policy against it.” Taken from Dead Reflection. So regardless of the chain-of-command, who is SFA or JFA, the show is saying there is no policy against dating a co-worker, period. And I would like to see the policy of the real NCIS, not the military policy. But like I said, it doesn’t really matter. There isn’t a policy barring Tony & Ziva from dating, and it really comes down to Gibbs & his team.

      • Gaara says:

        I’m just speculating here, but I think that at the time TPTB wasn’t sure if season 10 would have been the final season or not, since Mark Harmon’s contract wasn’t renewed yet (and we all know no Gibbs = no NCIS). So when it was clear they could keep going, they backpedaled on the Tiva front.
        Me, I’m not that mad about it. By now it’s so obvious that it’s not a matter of “if”, but only “when”, so as long as we keep having Tiva scenes and (albeit slow) progression, I’m happy and I don’t mind the waiting :)

      • srsly says:

        Gary has never been carefully measured in any of his interviews. Let’s get that straight. He fancies himself quite clever with his little wink wink nudge nudge Bob is your uncle hints and teases. As far as what MW tweeted, with the lack of intonation or other indicators, no one can know if he was directed to do it by those two harpy CBS publicists who only push the Ziva/tiva agenda, if he was happy about it, or if he saw the writing on the walls as to the horribly misguided direction of this season and was being sarcastic. He has been increasingly vocal against this pairing and for good reasons. Even if he were for the pairing, the small, nasty contingent who support it constantly going after himself, his friends and his family (including his unborn child! WTF?!) would be more than enough to make him never want to go there no matter what. Pandering to this faction is sheer foolishness and the seesawing ratings last fall as well as the disturbing rhetoric online only prove it.

        • Voice of Reason says:

          @srsly – S10 had massive ratings. That line doesn’t wash. Now you are even attacking the “harpy” NCIS/CBS publicists!!??!!
          For the record, alot of actors are against any couple getting together TOO SOON on their show. Nathan Fillion was the same in Casle, and he often referred to the supposed Moonlighting Curse as his reason for not wanting Kate and Rick to get together in his show. However, the showrunner writes the show’s direction, not the actors… and Nathan has since admitted that if written well, getting a couple together can be done well and does not have to “ruin” a show. Castle has managed very well this last season since getting their leads together.
          My point here is that even if an actor feels some trepidation at how ratings will be affected when a show moves from UST to engaging in a romatic relationship between some key characters, their viewpoint does not necessarily have any impact whatsoever on what the showrunner does. It is up to the showrunner and the writing team (and in this case the network, I suspect) to make decisions about Tiva.

          • BB123 says:

            Good point Voice of Reason.
            I might Psych as an example to a succefull writing of a relationship that isn’t the focus of the show, like it would be in NCIS. Shawn and Juliet are together now, they have some scene and lines, one or two episode are about them and the relationship, but Shawn & Gus are still the main focus of the show !

          • srsly says:

            Castle was created with two costars who were intended to be together from the beginning, not an ensemble show. There is a huge difference between the two. There are plenty of examples of shows which have crashed and burned after pairing a couple up and those shows don’t have the added issue of a problematic message of partner abuse and betrayal.

  12. Nubiesque says:

    I hate to sound cynical & I apologize to TV Line if I do…but I do not understand the “Jenga-ish” concern at all, regarding NCIS. I must be missing something, because after ELEVEN years on the air, you have a show runner is who is “still worried” about playing the wrong card, or making the wrong move??! What could be wrong about Tony & Ziva THIS late in the series? This poor show is ready to say goodbye soon up the road, and every.single.hit.show that shares the same “procedural drama” category is literally passing NCIS by – even it’s own SISTER show (“NCIS:LA”) has moved further along than the mothership, and they’re only in their 4th season!! I’m sorry, but that HAS to be embarrassing for NCIS.

    If Gary Glasberg or anyone else over there is soooo worried about “making the wrong move” after all this time has gone by – then for Heaven’s sake – please, just STOP. Stop the Tiva Pimping that the CBS network has been shamelessly indulging in for monetary windfalls, and say goodbye to the series with a Grand, Gibbs sendoff. Gibbs still commands about half of that “20 million” viewership, as he is the Star. The other half of that number WILL suffer some kind viewership severance from the Tiva fallout, but if CBS doesn’t mind ending on a lessor note, then that’s great!! I think Tony & Ziva have unfortunately missed their critical timing due to Glasberg’s delaying variation of the Lying Game(s), but I still love the whole cast.

    • Jack Wahl says:

      If you read a lot of the fan groups. There is a very vocal group of posters (who by in large female) have intense animus towards TIVA and the Ziva David character. They empathically screams about TIVA being shoved down their throats (a epithet that bigots and also racist uses) Maybe that’s reason for the glacial speed to fully develop this story line.

      • Nubiesque says:

        Hi Jack – Sadly, I admit that I’m well aware of the handful of indviduals of whom you speak. I’ve been following NCIS for a very long time, and some of those same people have often disagreed with my POV, which is fine with me. I have no desire to argue re: any one character, because I’m resolute in how I feel, and no vitriolic “racist or bigoted” remarks will ever induce me to change my position after all these years. Gibbs, Ziva, Tony, etc. are all FICITIONAL products of the people who created them. Lashing out at the actual professionals who bring them to life (or secretly slandering their ethnicity, etc.) never bodes well for a fan; it’s unhealthy.

        However, if Glasberg & or any other NCIS producer is assimilating their characters’ progression (i.e.: “glacial speed”) by how outrageous these “posters” can become in their negative outcrys, then would that not testify to the weakness of the production/editorial staff, by proving that they are unable to make Executive-level decisions and simply move things along as THEY see fit? If true, than these so-called animus viewers, I think, are being given far more credit than they actually deserve.

        • anna says:

          It’s funny how whenever an objection comes to ziva and/or tiva, the ojection is automatically labeled as racist or bigoted. The mere idea that ziva is an abuser and that the relationship is a bad idea from back in S6 is beyond some people. Add to that the idea that the show has essentially jumped the shark already just to legitimize a character’s presence….

          you can laud Castle or NCIS LA all you want but their entire premise was different from NCIS from creation. & it’s no big shock that LA is moving faster at pairings than NCIS. Look at their showrunner. Part of the reason now that NCIS is still floundering is because of the damage Shane Brennan did to the characters in his efforts to twist the show into what he thought it should be.

          • Nubiesque says:

            ..and yet, YOU felt compelled to respond, huh Anna? Self-ID’ng again, are we? The racist/bigotry remarks didn’t come from me; I was responding to someone else – go back and review. However I’m not mad at you, because frankly – I agree with you about SB. Nontheless I appreciate his talent; he is far better of a storyteller, in my book – even though he didn’t do everything perfectly, in the eyes of many. I like his style for the most part, and I enjoy what he’s doing on “LA”. It’s much more fast-paced & intense and I look forward to kicking things up a notch every Tuesday at 9:00 when NCIS is over.

          • SAM says:

            Anna, I’m sorry, but a show that’s averaging around 20 million viewers per episode isn’t floundering.

          • anna says:

            ahhh Nubie…if you paid 1/2 as much attention to what I’ve said as you and your band of merry shippers (Hi SAM) like to pretend you do, then you’d know that neither I nor many others who don’t like the pairing or the character have ever said anything racist about the character or the actress

          • SAM says:

            Hello to you too Anna. But if you actually read what Nubie said in her post, you would see that she never said that you or your immediate circle of friends said that you did say anything racist. That you and they seem so touchy about the subject might cause some people to think that some of you might have guilty consciences. Emphasis on the word “might”. But you know, it’s just possible that she and others have come across people who have said some questionable things, things that might be construed as racist. No need for you to automatically think that she was talking about you.

        • Lillian says:

          There are a lot more who are against a romance between team members than a “handful.” If one were to go by the people who reply here and on some other boards, then one can say the same about a “handful” of people who are for the pairing. I keep seeing the same names as well. The Executives are making decisions as THEY see fit, and pay little mind to each “handful” of people proclaiming they know how this particular storyline should go.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            no one knows how many people who are for or against. i mean, unless you’re saying you’re omniscient? Because the only person or being that i know that meets that description is God.

          • Lillian says:

            @4luv I was replying to your fellow Tiva fan, who claims there are only a handful of people who are against the pairing. Perhaps you should direct your “omniscient” comment to her, as well? Or is that not done among Tiva fans?

          • Gabi says:

            Is there ANY way that you’ll stop being rude? Like damn, take it easy

          • BB123 says:

            Are you all aware that we are what ? less than 10 people to feed this thread (lets count there’s the two voices, alisia, srsly, anna, Gabi Lillian, @4luv and myself (I may forget someone).) and non of us hardly represent the fandom as a whole ????
            Just checking and making sure that we’re 10 people among 20 millions watchers…And I don’t even count because I am not american (but In my country NCIS is a huge success too).

          • Lillian says:

            It was your buddy who was rude, asking if I was omniscient. You don’t get that, do you?

          • Gabi says:

            This is sooo annoying. How rude some of these tiva/ziva haters are.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            Yes, Lillian, it would be true for either side. It’s difficult to trace back to an original comment. I’ll make sure I go back & hunt it down so I can post the same comment to them as well.

        • OneOldLadysOpinion says:

          To Nubiesque, mature comment at last! I myself was going to reply to Mr Jack Wahl but you did a marvelous job! Truly, I’ve only GROWN to like Ziva, mainly I admit because I missed Kate plus her character has developed over the time she’s been a part of the show but I doubt the people who like the idea of a relationship between the characters are bigots or racists just because they express what they want to see on a show they happen to like I also doubt they are mostly women as I believe he implied, sorry, if I misunderstood him. I’ve seen most of the real life people who play these roles on talk shows & EVERY SINGLE ONE says the same, it’s like a family on the set, they care about one another. It’s my opinion that is the real reason it has had such a long run, they care about each other & it shows in their work & folks it is WORK, their work for our enjoyment so lets all just enjoy & let it unfold as it does. Things happen in life that can’t be controlled which will in some way affect shows we like for instance as I mentioned I HATED it when Kate got killed BUT Sasha wanted off so that’s the way they handled it & just as in real life I got over it even eventually learned to love Ziva as part of the TEAM! Now if it were real life I would have to say from all indications Tony was & is in love with Kate so how does that fit with a relationship between Tony & Ziva, what’s his goldfish’s name? As far as it being just us women who carry on about it one way or the other give me a break, PLEASE!

          • Nubiesque says:

            @oneOldLadysOpinion – aww, thank you; you’re sweet! I don’t like to comment like this too much, because of what you’ve witnessed: some abandon all Maturity & get UGLY on here. I think you said it very well: they do care for one another a great deal. I enjoyed early NCIS, but to me there is NO comparison whatsoever between Kate & Ziva. Kate had more chemistry with Gibbs, than she ever did with Tony. That was confirmed by DiNozzo himself, when he stated to Ziva that Kate was more like a “sister” to him, than anything else. To Tony she was apparently too puritannical. Plus, Kate dismissed Tony quite a bit as a mere “pig”. It’s interesting some people thrive on bashing Ziva for putting Tony in his place when needed, yet Kate did it to him ALL the time!! If it may encourage you at all, I wouldn’t worry too much about that small handful who don’t care for Ziva. DePablo has taken NCIS by storm with her potrayal of Ziva, and the series made Canon History this year – due to Cote’s outstanding performance. NCIS will never be the same; Ziva David has shined such an incredibly unique light on the series. I love her character just as much as you do. I just want her to be written better – more consistently. The same goes for DiNozzo’s character :)

          • Gina says:

            Nubiesque I agree with you on everything you’ve said, it would be so great if we could hold discussions like these one without offending each other.

          • OneOldLadysOpinion says:

            I never thought much about the Tony Kate connection either until the episode where Gibbs saw them as a couple when he was contiplating on his life & decisions he had made that he thought perhaps had adversely affected his team my husband was less surprised than me, then there was the goldfish so I had perhaps a second thought, but I agree that even at the time it made me think back about how really protective of one another they were regardless of how they trash talk each other, actually made me tear up–skeptics shoot me but I admit it I did! I think what folks think is a “love” connection with Tony & Ziva is just trying to kinda replicate that back & forth he & Kate had, Ziva’s character just isn’t the same type to quip as easily as did Kate’s. I love everyone of the characters & will sorely miss the show when it’s reached it’s inevitable end! I don’t really comment on these sites either—guess I’m just to old for it seems odd that people can argue over a show albeit a GREAT show when the world is decaying in front of our eyes, I freely admit its one reason I watch it though at least on a show things CAN have a happy ending. To bad Mr Bellisairus is to sick to still be running the show as at least I believe that is the case, I think it must be hard to take someone else’s vision & still make as they would have. It’s very interesting to see him on the extras on the DVD sets–the early years anyway, I haven’t watched newer ones in this way but plan on it.

        • Voice of Reason says:

          True. Regardless of what any viewers say on forums such as this, if TPTB have a quality story to tell then they should go ahead and tell it without the need to pander to any faction in the fanbase – espeically not fans who display racist and bigoted views.

        • 4luvofncis says:

          In order to be fair, I have to respond that there is no way to know whether it’s a handful of individuals Jack is referring to or not.

        • 4luvofncis says:

          Everyone should take & breath about the whole racist comment, and ask Jack what he meant by it. Because I don’t think it’s perfectly clear. It could be that he was saying the phrase “shoved down our throats” is used by those against “TIVA” like it’s often used by racists or bigots when they ignorantly feel something or someone is “shoved down their throats,” not equating the two or drawing a line from racists to “Anti-tiva” fans at all. I’m not saying I disagree or agree with this thought process. But I think Jack is saying that he feels fans against “TIVA” have the same stance or attitude that someone with a racist/ignorant view might have, like it’s perceived through the same filter. I don’t think he was saying the reason people who not in favor of “TIVA” is because they are racist or possess bigotry. Just some thoughts. Perhaps he can clarify.

      • lyn says:

        I’d rather see a romance between McGee and Abby than Tiva. Ziva is too cold, too butch and too guarded for outgoing, fun loving Tony. What I’d really love is for them to bring in Tea Leoni as a love interest for Gibbs.

      • turretgunner says:

        I’m not sure I understand. Are you saying that there is a vocal group of fans who object to TIVA because Ziva is Jewish and Tony is…not? Or is it because Cote dePablo is Chilean and Michael weatherly is Anglo? if it is either, that’s very disappointing.

        • anna says:

          Nubiesque might be saying that turretgunner but he/she has no proof that’s ever been said anywhere…
          Unless of course they are referring to more insults to MW like the MOTE shippers seem to love to dish out

      • Andrea says:

        Jack is making a generalization to an entire group of people, and that generalization is untrue. That’d be like saying that those who like Tony and Ziva like them because those people like to read romance novels. I do not dislike Ziva because she’s Jewish, Cote’s South American, or because Michael is White. I dislike Tony and Ziva because I find a romantic relationship to be unnecessary to the show, and I don’t think there’s any sort of “connection” there worth talking about. I dislike Ziva because I feel like I’m always manipulated to feel sorry for her or she’s written like a b**** with no sense of humility, and I’m supposed to think that’s a strong woman. I do not agree with that.

      • paula says:

        Omg, now im a racist bugot, omg. Half my family is Jewish. I cant believe you said that. I am nit a racist or bugot because i dont like Ziva or Tiva. I never liked her from the first time she appeared. The way this show has portraid Mossad and there agents is insulting. Israel is an ally not the enemy. Ziva isnt even portraied as a good Iraeli.

      • srsly says:

        Jack, your accusation is vile and so insanely off base as to be laughable if it weren’t so offensive. Nice to see the tivanista brigade is still in fine form with their specious insults since any rational defense of their princess is impossible.

      • 4luvofncis says:

        Posting here as well: It could be that Jack was saying the phrase “shoved down our throats” is used by those against “TIVA” like it’s often used by racists or bigots when they, albeit ignorantly, feel something or someone is “shoved down their throats,” not equating the two or drawing a line from racists to “Anti-tiva” fans, at all. I’m not saying I disagree or agree with this thought process. But perhaps Jack is saying that he feels fans against “TIVA” have the same stance or attitude that someone with a racist/ignorant view might have, like it’s perceived through the same TYPE of filter. I don’t think he was saying the reason people who not in favor of “TIVA” is because they are racist or possess bigotry. But I could be wrong. Just some thoughts. Perhaps he can clarify.

  13. Maria says:

    I watch NCIS and am neutral about Tony and Ziva getting together. I adore Castle and think the show made the right move putting Castle and Beckett together. The difference is, Castle was created by the showrunner (Andrew Marlowe) as a kind of “love letter” to his wife (Terri Miller), and the Castle-Beckett relationship is a testament to Marlowe and Miller’s relationship. With NCIS, it is first and foremost a military drama. Any love stories are…and should remain…secondary.

    • Ken Carter says:

      I agree 100%. Leave it a military drama, and no to the sex.

    • Becca says:

      That’s a great point about Castle being a love story. I’m sure there are a lot of people who will insist that it’s just a quirky, romantic take on a standard crime procedural, but for me Castle has always been first and foremost about the relationship. And that focus is definitely what makes me tune in.

    • B says:

      I do think NCIS has forgotten it’s a military drama, at times.

      • 4luvofncis says:

        NCIS execs Gary & Mark want it to be more than a crime procedural. So, no it has not forgotten. It can be whatever it wants to be, still be as successful not being boxed in, and did anyone complain about Tony’s sex w/Jeanne? Or Gibbs’ sex w/Mann or Ryan? Or Ziva’s sex w/Michael or Michael? Or Tony’s sex w/EJ? I’m not talking about the “who’s” of the situation, I’m talking about the fact that there has been plenty of “sex” in the “military drama” as some fans see it as.

        • Alisa Neely says:

          i HATED the relationship with Jeanne…..i felt she was TOO needy and DEMANDING…..she felt if tony was alright with moving into an apartment with her…..he’d be OVER joyed to BUY a house…..even her co-worker thought that was over board……i HATED that whole “frog” storyline……because, in the end tony was HURT by MORE then just the director who USED him for her own means…..but, by his team…..i HATED Mann as well….she too thought too HIGHLY of herself….and didn’t know HOW to RESPECT jethro’s privacy….going to his friends to get information on him….and so many other things……BOTH relationships felt FORCED…..the same as it does with “TIVA”……imo, their is 0 REAL chemistry between tony & ziva…….not only that: tony NEVER truely needed a reason to see gibbs…..but, that last time he went to see him…..there wasn’t that easy going feeling, that once was……i feel that connection between gibbs and tony has SUFFERED in favor for TIVA……we’ve had very LITTLE of the friendship that seemed to form between tim and tony, during the time ziva was GONE that time……and it DOES feel as if EVERY thing HAS to be about ZIVA…..we get VERY little storylines about the OTHER characters….i.e. DUCKY, ABBY, TIM AND JIMMY…..and i for 1, would LOVE to learn MORE about tony’s work with the police departments, before becoming an NCIS agent……tony IS the agent he is, because of his POLICE background….not everything can be investigated by computer…..it takes old fashioned hitting the streets….tim doesn’t like to do things the old way…..i’d LIKE to see, them do MORE where they have to do door to door stuff…..and use connections….like tony has.

          alisa

          • BB123 says:

            Quick question : Do you love anyone with Tony ??? Or your just too much of a fangirl and only want a spitting image of yourself as his girlfriend ?
            Also Are you aware that Tony made mistakes too ? That Tony is far from perfect and that’s why he is that good of a character ?
            I have to say, you seems like the kind of fan that hate everything that can hurt poor little Tony. Such things are a disservice to Tony characters since he can handle those hurts quite well. Even Better he isn’t hypersensitive and wasn’t hurt deeply by at least half the things you say.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            Alisa, it really isn’t necessary to emphasize your words by capitalizing them, as if we’re not going to understand what you’re saying or get your point. I mean, you’ve only posted the same exact thing like 10 times. I actually feel sorry for you that you clearly don’t enjoy this show and then post about everything you hate about it.

      • SAM says:

        DPB said from the get go that he wanted the show to be more than just a military drama.

        • Yes….and DBP even said on the Season 1 DVDs that he wanted to explore how a couple could handle a personal and professional relationship after seeing that a former Director of NCIS was married to a NCIS agent. And apparently there are quite a few real life couples within the NCIS agency, just like any other agency or business.

          • srsly says:

            I’ll bet you none of them have ever pulled a gun on the other and accused their partner of murder. Just sayin…

    • JC says:

      I agree that you can’t compare “Tiva” to Caskett or the Bones couple. Shows like that – written around a central couple – well, it’s kind of an apples and oranges comparison comparing them with ensemble procedurals. But I think you can still do pairings on those shows as well. The Mentalist has had Rigsby/Van Pelt. CSI:NY had Danny/Lindsay. CSI had Grissom/Sara (although I personally loathed GSR). And NCIS LA is doing a fine job in my opinion with Kensi/Deeks. I think the problem with Tiva (well, at least for me it is) is that for the greater of 6-7 years, the writers have been content to write their relationship on the emotional level of hair-pulling grade-schoolers. A fair amount of bickering is fine. But the writers got stuck there and until recently (VERY recently) never bothered developing the relationship beyond that. Yes, there were the rare occasional moments. But it wasn’t enough to give the relationship any depth. Compare where Kensi and Deeks are at the end of S4 with where Tony and Ziva are now. There is far far too much water under the bridge and the show has too much other baggage for me to be ok with it at this point. If they’d started much much earlier, say 5-6 years ago, I dare say I would be on the pro-Tiva side rather than being against it.

  14. the girl says:

    Matt, I’d really like to know your thoughts on the Resurrection pilot. I want to be excited about it, but now I learned it’s based off a book and that has changed my expectations a bit. Keep us posted when you get to the midseason entries.

  15. wordsmith says:

    Thanks for the scoop on the pilots! Really looking forward to hearing your thoughts in greater detail as fall approaches.

  16. Jared says:

    I’m gonna need those BATB and Arrow premiere dates ASAP!..lol

  17. Julie Pham says:

    Yes, I can’t wait for Psych return and return of desperaux.

  18. tobes says:

    Matt, is the pilot for Betrayal really bad?

    • Matt Webb Mitovich says:

      As noted above, I haven’t gotten to ABC dramas. (They only just sent DVDs this week.)

      • brb123 says:

        Have you gotten to any of the CW pilots?

        • Matt Webb Mitovich says:

          Only THE TOMORROW PEOPLE, which right now I have ranked as high as Fox’s ALMOST HUMAN and did not end the way I thought it would. Definite potential.

          • brb123 says:

            Thanks, that’s the CW pilot that interests me the most (and FOX’ Almost Human is the FOX pilot I’m most looking forward to.)

          • Ram510 says:

            Tomorrow People was the only new CW show I was really interested in. To me it looked exactly how you described it, having “potential” I just hope it’s not slow like Secret Circle cause it also had potential but shot itself in the foot by taking too long with the story

  19. Katie says:

    I have watched NCIS since season one…. And at some point, I fell into this whole TIVA fandom. I think written the write way, it adds to the show…. Because its character development… A side to them we have yet to see. To be honest, I know very few work places where people spend 60+ hours a work week, with a tight knit group and there not be some flirting…. Or people attempting to hide a romance of sorts. It seems like that is human nature so from a realistic stand point, I think it’s expected by people. On the other hand, if they choose to not write it, give them each a love interest outside of NCIS. People in that line of work have families at home and loved ones – who aren’t assassins, contract killers, rogue Mossad agents, or die as a result of work, why should they be any different?

  20. Mafa says:

    After all these times I wrote you decide to choose my question only to NOT answer it AT ALL!

    Thanks Matt for nothing!

    • Mafa says:

      Ooops!

      I guess I haven’t read properly. You did answer my question, it just wasn’t that interesting ;)

  21. Kelly says:

    I’m a huge NCIS fan and love all the characters on the show, but especially Tony and Ziva. Personally, whether or not Tiva happens, it won’t make or break my interest in the show. I know it can get heated in the Tiva versus no Tiva debate, so I just wanted to say kudos on a thoughtful and respectful discussion so far. Also, thanks to Matt (love your writing) and the TVLine crew for always having such great NCIS coverage when so many other sites pass it by.

  22. Amber says:

    I have to say, Im really intrigued as to how psych will explain Juliet’s absence in the 5 episodes. But I doubt that will be released until its actually close to the premiere, or just not at all.

    Also, if Maggie’s new show doesn’t last, would that just immediately clear her up for more psych? I don’t want it to fail, but the trailer didnt really impress me, honestly.

    • Mac says:

      Why do you think she is going to be absent for 5 episodes? Season 8 still only has 8 episodes because the other 5 scripts the network ordered have not yet been added to the season. Of those 8 episodes it has been rumored that she will be filming 5 which means she will be absent for only 3 episodes. Also i say rumor because a couple of weeks ago at the USA Network Upfronts one reporter asked her outright if she was leaving Psych and her response was “no i am still doing Psych, i am going to be really busy” she is doing both shows. Now my guess is that she would only say that if she was doing more than 5 episodes, so i think we are going to see a lot more of Juliet than you think. If the 5 extra scripts are finally added i have heard that she will be doing at least some of those episodes. She isn’t leaving, also creator of Psych Steve Franks just recently stated that Shawn and Juliet’s relationship is safe and this was after her new show got picked up. He also said that if her show got picked up that they had a great contingency plan in place. Also you should remember that her shooting schedules for Psych and her new show do not coincide because they shoot at different times of the year so she will continue to be on Psych even if her new show continues. I don’t think her will last very long though because it is pretty bad and ABC usually scraps shows even before a full season airs so seeing as season 8 of Psych (currently filming with Maggie) doesn’t air until 2014 it’s entirely possible that her new show will be cancelled by then or at least be on the bubble. Remember though that James Roday has already said that season 8 is the last season. This is also why Maggie took that pilot in the first place, and i am pretty sure that she wasn’t the only cast member looking for a new job during the long hiatus, she was just the only one that got lucky.

      • ScarlettH says:

        I think Kurt Fuller scored a gig as well but not a lead role like Maggie’s. Her character could still leave but doesn’t mean Shawn and Jules are gonna break up. I think they’re gonna pull a Castle, only in this case have Jules take the job. I can see it happening IF she’s gonna be absent for more than half the season.

  23. Rodge1978 says:

    I can’t wait for season 8 of Psych, those three in England should be a great episode. Maybe Lassie as Snape, Despereaux as Malfoy, Gus as Harry, Shawn as Ron, Jules as Hermione :~)

  24. Chris says:

    I’m disappointed to hear that about Sleepy Hollow. At least i still have Almost Human and The Blacklist to look forward to.

  25. Estee Thomas says:

    oh goodie! i can’t wait to see psych head “across the pond” :)

  26. As much as it would be fun to see some racy scenes between Tony and Ziva, I think popping that er, bubble would be a show disaster. They should save it for what they KNOW will be the last season. Not a series finale cliff hanger, but once everyone agrees X will be the last season, work it in starting with the beginning of the last season.

  27. Betty says:

    I glanced at the picture and for a fleeting moment thought there was West Wing news.

  28. Patti says:

    Thanks for the Psych scoop. Sounds like a great episode.

  29. lizzie says:

    First and foremost, thank you to Matt for giving us such a thoughtful answer on the Tiva question. I’m a Tiva fan. But I’m a fan of the show and the characters. I think they’ve gone so far down the road towards pairing these two that doing anything else would feel false and a shortchanging of the characters. The characters have been show as evolving towards that, and I think it’s certainly brought out good sides in both of them. I’d like to see more of that and to see them, and the rest of the team, cope with the complexities. I think it would be happy and hopeful and fun and provide opportunities for all characters. I don’t want it to take over the show, either. But I don’t see that it would have to take any more time than the will-they/won’t-they is taking now. And I have great faith in the crew to make it great.

    • 4luvofncis says:

      This, exactly!! I have trouble understanding why people feel it’s taken away from their characters. Brought out strengths & positives of their characters as you said. I believe this is exactly what the show is doing with this relationship. It is about beating the odds stacked up against it, as MW layed out in his SARCASTIC, WITTY, NOT-TO-be-TAKEN-LITERAL, TONGUE-N-CHEEK interview. I too would like to see the team & Tony/Ziva cope with the complexities of their romance. I think there is so much depth & opportunity there. I agree, the debate is what is skewing how much time the show really invests in “tiva.”

      • Gabi says:

        I completely agree with you. These characters have been through hell and back together and I think that in order for them to be happy, they should really be with each other. I mean, who else could they be paired with Jeanne or EJ and Ray or Michael ? NO. They are so complex that I only see them being compatible with each other. They are perfect together ♥

        • NoTiva says:

          Yeah, Ziva has put Tony through Hell and continues to do so. That doesn’t look like love to me. It looks more like solid grounds for a restraining order. Nice of Matt to recognize that there are fans who recognize the pairing as the toxic trainwreck that it is, even if his math is far too conservative. Beyond the problematic nature of the pairing, the wanking of Ziva has corrupted and disrupted the rest of the characters and story lines to such a disturbing degree that some of the characters are nearly unrecognizable from who they were just 5 seasons ago. Most people who don’t want Ziva/tony don’t visit TVLine because of its record for pandering to the tivanistas and their nasty personal attacks in the comments. NCIS is playing with fire and they have created their own monster in encouraging the entitlement spewed by the tivanista contingent.

          • Gabi says:

            OK. realise that everything you just said, has been talked out between them. She has apologized since then. And that was FOREVER ago. They have each other’s back. They have grown to really love each other. Tony and Ziva aren’t like that anymore. Have you SEEN recent episodes? Cause it’s pretty obviosu that their relationship has changed a whole lot since Somalia and Michael and everything. They have full trust in each other now. So what you said just now doesn’t even make sense. And who did Ziva betray? Cause it sure as hell wasn’t her team, that’s her FAMILY.
            And that’s just Tony and Ziva’s realtionship, they don’t even mean 1/2 the stuff they say (when they’re being rude to each other) but if they hated each other, would they risk their lives for each other? And would they have the heart to heart conversations that they have? I don’t think so. I think Gary desgined these two characters for each other.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            I agree with Gabi, except for the Gary designed T/Z. I continue to recognize each & every character. No, I don’t see a toxic train wreck at all. But Tony & Ziva have been on this journey since Cote was signed in 2003, so all EPs – Don B, Shane B & then Gary G have done a great job of continuing it & handing off the baton with each writing team.

          • Gabi says:

            Exactly. They have had a bumpy ride and have had quite a few arguments, but look at them. Tony put his life at rish to save her.. And that was season friggin 7. NOW? They have full trust in each other and they know that they have each other’s back. Idk how you think their relationship is a train wreck cause honestly, I think they’re AT LEAST best friends. He even said it himself. The looks they give each other, you can’t tell me you don’t notice the looks, cause they are loud and clear. I think they love each other, wether it’s romantically or continued as best friends, that’s still not decided.

          • anna says:

            @gabi…

            disturbing comment ‘ if they hated each other would they risk their lives for each other’
            As LEOs and team mates, yes, that’s exactly what they do…

            beyond that their relationship has not changed much since Somalia….ziva never apologized for the assault. GG is operating under the assumption that Tony is a forgiving person and has forgiven her – probably because he doesn’t appear to want to touch much of what Brennan developed.
            Beyond that ziva’s rude comments and insults aren’t the least bit amusing or funny and why Tony puts up with them is unknown. She’ a junior agent at best who is allowed to give orders to her team’s SFA….something is very wrong there

          • Gabi says:

            @anna
            These two characters are VERY playful, they say a rude comment here and there (not just Ziva to Tony), but the look that they give each other right after makes it all better. They know what they can and can’t say because they are Indeed BEST FRIENDS. As Tony said.
            As for the assualt. If I remember correctly, there was a bathroom scene were Ziva apologizes to Tony and then thanks him for having her back. She then realizes she can trust him fully and their relationship since then has been growing very rapidly, telling each other things that they wouldn’t tell anybody else and giving each other precious looks. Their relationship has changed A LOT. Maybe it’s because you don’t like her, which I don’t see how you could dislike the beautiful Ziva David, but a lot of us on tumblr sure do see it.

      • anna says:

        Because of course there’s nothing more important than seeing the first date, the first kiss, the first time in bed, the morning after that time….all sandwiched between a case every week….

        Never mind the idea that thanks to ziva, Tony has basically lost ALL of his skills and depth as a character that he had before this show was ‘Leave it to Ziver’

        • Gabi says:

          Yes! I completely agree <3 it's true that we wanna see all that stuff but the show doesn't revolve around it like some people are saying.

          • anna says:

            Finally an admission that’s what is desired…so explain how in the world the show won’t change if tivas get what they demand out of making that not-romance canon

          • Gabi says:

            @anna
            I NEVER said the show wouldn’t change, I said the show doesn’t revolve around tiva. And non-romantic? Oh my God. These two love each other. A LOT. They’ve expressed it so many times. So try again cause that’s love.

        • SAM says:

          First of all Anna, blame real people, like writers, for the problems with a fictional character, not another fictional character. Secondly, there are people out there — and yes, a significant number — who simply don’t believe the character has been totally ruined. Again, just your opinion, and the opinion of some others who agree with you. And yet, people keep watching. Either they disagree with you about how Tony is written, or it simply doesn’t bother them.

        • tatiana says:

          Ana
          How is Ziva fault that according to you Tony has basically lost all of his skills and depth? Since when Ziva writes for NCIS?
          It is very funny how people blame a character for what writers do.
          Yes this season has had a lot of Ziva, but last season was all about Tony, then we have a season that is not all about him and some fans go crazy.

          • anna says:

            If one pays attention to the episodes, most of Tony’s skills have been moved to ziva…& now this season we have her regularly giving orders to both Tony & McGee as if she were the team’s SFA…

            Beyond that – how in the world was S9 the Tony season?

        • Alisa Neely says:

          i agree with you Anna…..and i DON’T believe ziva’s apology….she was FORCED to do so, by BOTH gibbs and abby….and she cornered tony in the MEN’S ROOM……….and Gabi: if ziva turly TRUSTED tony….she would STOP hiding things from him that could effect the AGENY….she KEPT vital information about her FATHER, from GIBBS….and look what happened….her father ended up DEAD as did JACKIE VANCE…..she only cares about HERSELF…..she doesn’t care about ANYONE else….and that includes TONY.

          • BB123 says:

            If you can tell me you would snitch on your own father without second thought about it, then I would consider your argument valid. And you as inhuman.

          • Alisa Neely says:

            just to add: ZIVA is a JR. agent…..but acts as if she is SFA…..and i for 1, which tptb would STOP with this…..and it’s time, they write gibbs having some GUTTS and truely putting her INTO her place….instead of patting her on the head and allowing her to get away with it……she is NOT tony’s boss and it’s time she is taken down off her high place……Gibbs is SA and tony is SFA, it’s time they were written as such…..HELL, even tim thought because of his MIT & JOHN HOPKINS education, he was better suited for the SFA then tony with a background in POLICE work.

            alisa

          • Gabi says:

            Wooow. Ok so you’re saying that it was wrong of her to “pick” family over her boss for a second and then recognize that she NEEDS her team, her FAMILY. Hey, she made a mistake, it happens! I still don’t understand why you even watch this show HATING one of the main characters ? That makes NO sense, if you hate her so damn much, whaaaat reason do you have to sit there and watch it? Good luck, cause it’s our year :p

          • mimi says:

            @BB123
            Ziva didn’t need to snitch or arrest her father after he confessed the murder of the journalist. She just needed to remember the Mossad Director secretly (illegaly?) in USA to meet a Palestinian head of the Iranian intelligence bureau that has killed an American citizen could be the target of many bad people. She just needed to take Eli to her home and then call Gibbs (her 2.0 daddy), and they’d have certainly found a solution to this mess.
            She should have ‘stopped’ not because she was an inhuman daughter, but because she wanted to protect her father and all the people around him too.
            But no, after Eli confessed the murder, she followed him to Vance’s house (where there could have been two children), as nothing had happened, and called Gibbs only when her father pi**ed her off with his speech about love, family, trust and not because it was the right thing to do.
            Once against she lied to her superiors, withheld vital info. Once again she acted too late and she did it only because something was affecting HER and not because it was the right thing to do. Once again it was all about herself and no one else.

            In SS we had ‘Rivkin mess pt2′. The first time the ICE Agent and Rivkin died. Tony was almost killed by her boyfriend because he wanted to give Ziva the chance to explain what he and Abby had found on her pc.
            This time her father and an innocent mother & wife died.

            In SS, she told Gibbs “I did not want to hide anything from you”, so he told her “Keep me updated” and she answered “Of course”. So after Rivkin and this last dialogue, I really thought she’d learnt the lesson… but nada.
            Unfortunately, she didn’t learn anything and two people died… *sigh*

          • srsly says:

            Yeah, BB, imagine, “snitching” on your father you disowned at least twice who killed someone. I’d think less of someone who disowned her father twice due to her own issues than a LEO who did her job despite personal responsibilities. Let’s get the facts right. Just for the record, Ziva never apologized for anything beyond not recognizing Tony had her back. Anything. And then, just a few episodes later, she did not have his back when he was canvassing for terrorists who had just killed 3 people in cold blood. She hasn’t had his back since and has thrown him to the wolves more than once when she isn’t simply haranguing him with how vile and inferior he is.

        • L. Burke says:

          Thanks! You got my frustrations with the recent writing of the show in a nutshell.

          And Tiza fans have never given a good logical way that Tony and Ziva could be involved with Tony being her superior officer and all. One of them would have to transfer off the team and end of show.

      • Darlene says:

        Oh, goodie. What fun! Not good enough that Tony and Ziva get together. Now ALL of the characters get to “shine” as we view their reactions to the many wonders of a Tiva relationship. Every week a new wonder revealed. Does Ducky get to be the Greek chorus commenting endlessly on the ongoing Tiva ups and downs and all around cuteness? Does Gibbs decide to move past Shannon because of the wondrous nature of the Tiva? Does McGee become the most popular author in the land because of the success of his new romance novels about Tiva? And what about Abby? Gosh, won’t she be excited to be the best man at their wedding. And Jimmy? He and Breena can give sage advice about relationships to Tiva. What wonderous stories can be told around this Tiva thing.

        Fine. Let’s not call it NCIS then. Let’s just rename the show The Many Adventures of Tiva.

        • mimi says:

          Thank you so much. LOL
          I really needed a good laugh after some things I’ve read here from fans and not only them.
          So after ZCIS, we could have The Many Adventures of Tiva and see Gibbs all excited to accompany his 2.0 daughter to the altar and then to become granpa Jethro. Good idea! *sarcasm*
          But they’d need to change the category of the show from drama to soap-opera.

        • 4luvofncis says:

          Yes because that’s CLEARLY what everyone’s been saying in this post. I mean, it’s an atrocity that fans are commenting on Matt’s material about TIVA specifically, and don’t fear that because they are talking about two characters, a significant element that the show itself presents, out of the team that must mean they don’t care about anything else or any other character & that all the characters are affected by TIVA & can’t develop exclusive to them. Clearly that’s what they’re saying.

          • Darlene says:

            I was responding to you, 4luvofncis. You’re the one who said, “I too would like to see the team & Tony/Ziva cope with the complexities of their romance. I think there is so much depth & opportunity there”. My reply merely expounded on that “wealth of opportunity available for the whole team as all of them, everyone, “cope with the complexities” of Tony and Ziva’s romance. I would not find that fun at all. Why does the entire team have to deal with Tiva in their midst? Let alone in depth?

          • 4luvofncis says:

            So you’re interpretation of my comment is that it’s all encompassing all the time? Of course it is. No, it’s one aspect of the show that would affect the team. The depth & opportunity has to do with the story writing of Tony/Ziva & how that plays out. Why does the team have to deal w/TIVA in their midst? How would they not? I never said it had to be the sole focus, nor is it. The success of this show, IMO, hinges upon how the characters relate. And almost the entire cast has said this. In depth is not what I said. That’s defined as the amount of time spent or the expanse at which as subject is covered. I’m talking about depth as something that’s profound & meaningful.

          • Darlene says:

            Well, okay then. Why does the team you mention have to deal with the profoundness of Tiva? Something that profound would require more than a comment during an episode from them and you did say there was so much “opportunity” there with the team AND Tony/Ziva to “cope with the complexities of their romance”. Would all that be happening every episode, every third episode, a couple of times in the season, or just a one-and-done?

          • 4luvofncis says:

            I’m not really interested in RE-explaining myself when a microscope is taken to my comments. I trust the writers to continue to write it in a smart, balanced, & insightful way, as they do with the case, & interaction between all the characters. And by balanced I mean when more attention is needed for a specific relationship, then it becomes the focus for however long it needs to be, which remains to be seen. That holds true for any of the relationships.

  30. Lillian says:

    Matt, am I reading you correctly? Are there people complaining that there’s not enough romance on Castle?

    • MF says:

      Where did you read that?

    • Becca says:

      People definitely commented on the recaps this season that there wasn’t enough “something” with Castle and Beckett. Though I think people commented more on a lack of physicality than romance.

    • MF says:

      Ah, didn’t read the NCIS spoiler bc I don’t watch the show.
      Now I did & get where you come from.

      And I actually see where Matt comes from, too: as he wrote, with the Castle-fandom it’s like you (read: ther writers) can’t win, regardless what they’re writing: for some fans it’s too much Caskett (even though this part of the fandom isn’t that vocal) & for others it’s far too less or just not what they wanted.

      This fandom is actually spoiled & some fans are just not able to see it. And the worst part is: there are “fans” who just can’t deal with different opinions. Unfortunately these people spoil the fun for others & make all the rest look bad.

      I still hope (even though I know it’s in vain) that the hiatius will calm some people down and by the start of season 6 the fans are able to enjoy the show without bashing each other & their opinions up…

      Sorry, I guess I run off the track…

    • 4luvofncis says:

      Haha! I love this remark. Touche, et Brute? ;)

  31. Kat says:

    I’m all for Tiva. With the writing on this show and the actors that do such a good job with it I think they can handle it. What I don’t enjoy seeing is the constant teasing about it and then never following through with it. That gets old after awhile.

  32. Terez says:

    No Bomer fix to fall, what in the world can we do?

  33. Lori says:

    I just love NCIS for the “family” group and live for the serious Tony moments that they throw out every now and then. I don’t care at all about Tony and Ziva together and if they are going to do it then they should wait until the very last episode and not a moment sooner. Just keep teasing if they have to. I actually prefer Tony with someone else b/c a Tony/Ziva relationship would be really destructive. I am not a great fan of the Ziva character and I hate the way she always gets the best of Tony and belittles him. I like serious character scenes between Tony/Gibbs and Tony/McGee and I really enjoy the character developement of those three characters. I love the close mentor relationship between Gibbs/Tony ala Franks/Gibbs and I love the very few and far between moments when McGee and Tony actually get along and respect each other. I would still watch if they moved forward with Tiva but I think they would anger the viewing beast that is the old cranky cusses out there that watch it for the military drama and gibbs.

    • Voice of Reason says:

      LOL at “old cranky cusses”!!! Ziva makes fun of Tony at times, but he also torments her endlessly, and is even worse towards poor McGee!! I think it is time all the people who are commenting on how Ziva calls Tony on his childishness (at times), took a moment to think on all the zillions of times that Tony taunts McGee mercilessly!! There are way more examples of that. So are they all going to start hating on Tony now and calling for him to be outed! It is too funny!! The inconsistency in the arguments that are used by some anti-Ziva/Tiva people on here baffles me, and does show that it is not reasoned opinion alot of the time, but flat out hate for Ziva no matter what the facts of the matter might be.

      • BB123 says:

        Exactly ! Your user name suits you very well.

        • Voice of Reason says:

          Thank you. People are allowed to like or dislike whichever characters they wish on a show. But let’s not deceive ourselves into thinking that our opinions are based on facts from what is shown in the show (as opposed to our personal biases, stereotypical attitudes we hold, or blatant shipper war stubbornness) when the facts prove otherwise. Tony does act like a child, he sleeps in a child’d bed for goodness sake. He makes fun of everyone, ogles anything in a skirt at every opportunity, and mocks McGee ALL THE TIME. I think it is outrageous and McGee should take Tony to the Harrassment and Bullying Tribunal immediately (said tongue in cheek, incase that wasn’t obvious).

          • die Stimme der Vernunft says:

            If you hate Tony so much, why do you want him with your wonder kitten?

  34. Lori says:

    I also believe Matt is correct with the very difficult balancing act they have to make all of their viewers happy. I don’t believe the actors actually want the relationship, the Tiva fans demand it and they try to appease that every few episodes or so with a little something, something. I get the impression Michael Weatherly is not a fan of Tiva. I can imagine his beautiful wife would prefer he just have an “off camera” HEALTHY relationship with an anonymous normal person that doesn’t involve long, dopey looks shared with Cote de Pablo as Ziva the person who the writers insist on outshining Tony in every fight scene. Bring on more undercover work with Tony/McGee banter and leave Ziva in the bullpen where she belongs for once.

    • Bran says:

      Oh please. He’s an actor. It’s his job. Stop it.

      • Lori says:

        Well then at least let him take a bullet for her or something galant and alpha male instead of always being in her shadow… :-)

        • Patricia says:

          I totally agree. I’m so sick of Ziva always being written to outshine Tony. I miss competent, smart, heroic Tony of the first few seasons. Then Shane Brennan decided Ziva had to reign superior at all times and Tony had to turn into a loser who now seems to disgust everyone. I would love to see Tony get to do something noble and actually have that be the focus instead of Ziva’s latest melodrama.

          • Gabi says:

            Actually. Tony is the character that’s changed for the better. He’s matured so much and everyone loves him so much. So Tony is not portrayed as a loser. Actaully he’s saved his team, including Ziva more than once. Ziva has actaully been the one that’s softened up. So you’ve obviously not followed this very well.

          • anna says:

            Gabi, I gotta ask – what show are you watching??? Tony is routinely belittled and insulted by ziva, is the butt of most of the first scene ‘comedy in the bullpen’ idiocy, plus is usually the one who looks stupid in the shadow of the greatness of ziva….

      • Voice of Reason says:

        ITA. Again, the logic used by some is so illogical. What Michael’s wife wants Michael to have to act out as part of his JOB is totally irrelevant. Michael is the actor, Tony is the character. Let’s not bring their personal lives into it.

        • anna says:

          Guess you’ve never seen the abuse dealt out on MW’s twitter from the MOTE shippers…..or how cdp acts like a dreamy school girl with her first crush when she talks about MW

          • Gabi says:

            Really anna? Really?
            Cote is a fun, bubbly and adorable person ALL of the time in interviews and stuff. It’s not just with Michael. That’s just her. Plus, from what they’ve said, they have a REALLY good relationship and they’re very good friends… again from what THEY have said.

          • anna says:

            Which just feeds into your MOTE fantiasies does it, Gabi?

          • SAM says:

            Well Anna, I’ve seen a number of women on the various web sites, as well as other actresses besides de Pablo talk like that about Weatherly. Guess they find the man charming.

          • Well, it’s a two way street for Michael as well….and thank goodness the majority of us are NOT Mote shippers…..because we respect Michael’s marriage to his gorgeous wife and Cote’s long term relationship to her boyfriend. And then there are all the times that Michael has gushed over Cote and her beauty. Like a lot of other women, I find Michael charming and sexy as well. :-)

    • Ridiculous says:

      This comment is so ridiculous that I don’t know if I should laugh or not. You do know that “his beautiful wife” married AN ACTOR, right? It’s HIS JOB! Your comment is insulting for Bojana and MW. Let’s the man do his job and keep yourself out of their private life, thanks.

      • Lori says:

        Wow, you’re the one taking it WAY to seriously… it’s a TV show. I have no interest in their personal lives and MW is the one that likened the TIVA relationship that keeps popping up in the script to a cold sore… not very flattering. I’m just not a huge fan of Ziva that’s all.

        • 4luvofncis says:

          That;s your interpretation. My interpretation: Called sarcasm, irony, a parody, tongue-n-cheek, etc. He’s tired of the teasing/lack of progression either way, & tired of the divided fan base, & tired of his & Cote’s work being overlooked & reduced down to a cute couple name. Their journey & relationship & history has much more depth than they are getting credit for, let alone their characters’ individual character development.

          • Lillian says:

            You base your “interpretation” one one interview, ignoring his other interviews/comments given that support the one you dismiss as tongue-in-cheek because you don’t agree. He’s stated in the past that he doesn’t like or want Tiva, he was just being more forthright in the latest interview.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            I really am tired of people telling me I’m wrong about or can’t accept someone else’s interpretation of how MW feels about TIVA, YOU DON’T KNOW ANY MORE THAN I DO! I preface my statement as my interpretation, yet the opposing side can say w/o question their interpretation is fact? I don’t think so. That is SO arrogant. LET ME BE CLEAR: Anything that MW has said in the past, based on any & every interview that has supposedly happened regarding the subject of ZIva or Tiva, I take as sarcastic & facetious. If you don’t, then you don’t. THAT DOES NOT MAKE IT FACT. UNLESS YOU HAVE ACTUALLY HAD A CONVERSATION WITH MICHAEL WEATHERLY, stop telling me what I interpret him saying or how is simply because I disagree with him on the subject.That’s actually not accurate anyway because I believe we do agree on the subject. How about, if you agree it IS a “literal” & forthright version, then of course you believe he doesn’t want or like Tiva, & YOU ignore everything he’s said or done in support of it.

  35. keith g.flemming sr. says:

    It will be interesting what happens with Kensi and Deeks as well as Tony and Ziva but more importantly what will happen to the friendship of Sam and Deeks

    • SAM says:

      Good point. Sitting there watching Deeks going through that torture and why he’s willing to endure most likely will cause Sam to have quite a bit more respect for him.

  36. Bran says:

    I don’t blame MW for any of this miscommunication. TPTB of NCIS are known to cut a scene to hell that their actors are hyping.(just look at the Tiva scene in Lifes Before His Eyes) It made MW look awful.

    At this point, they just need to do something. Put them together or just end it. The stalling is what will ruin the show. It’s ****ing frustating/disappointing and just flat out awful TV.

    • Voice of Reason says:

      There seems to be a disconnect somewhere between what the actors (and even the publicists and promoters) say about the direction of the show, and what the showrunner does. I would think that the actors are given short ropes as to what they are allowed to say, and which aspects of the episodes they are allowed to comment on and hype up. For Michael to have promoted Tiva so much this past season, and in particular to have really stirred up the fanbase to expect Tiva greatness from certain episodes, and then for it to have fallen short… it does make me wonder what is going on behind the scenes. Perhaps some scenes are being cut to hell, as you put it. If so, that is worrying because the actors will be attempting to deliver certain “truths’ in a given scene, but then TPTB cuts that scene to portray something else. It is ingenious, I woud have thought. And it must be frustrating as hell for the actors, too. (And the writers). Let alone the fans.

      • anna says:

        actually there isn’t really….

        The publicists (katie & kristen) only appear to promote episodes that revolve around ziva & tiva. they also, on their twitter accounts, from what I’ve been told are very unprofessionally rude when a comment is made that is less than favorable to ziva or tiva.

        perhaps the disconnect that you think you see is really a difference in the actual definition of the word tiva as far as the showrunner goes.

        • Darlene says:

          You’re right. Gary often uses “friend” and “co-worker” when talking about the Tiva relationship. In that regard, he delivered Tiva this year. Trouble is, what he’s talking about and what fans of Tiva expect are obviously two different things.

        • Voice of Reason says:

          Well then, Anna. What does that tell you about what TPTB think about receiving the barrage of hate from the likes of yourself on twitter, when people like yourself spew forth your hate and bitterness and vitriole towards Ziva over and over again like a stuck record?!?! It tells me they are sick to death of it and have no time for it. Thank goodness for that!! Ziva is NOT being written the way you so ardently claim. If that is how you READ what you see on the TV screen, then perhaps you need to re-evaluate WHY that is. Because clearly, it is NOT what TPTB intend to portray, and it is NOT what I see when I watch the show.

          • Gabi says:

            @voiceofreason
            Lol I think I’ve commented in pretty much everything you’ve written.. because you are the Jesus if words<3 you spell out my exact thoughts. I can't put my thoughts into words like this but you're doing it beautifully. Thank you for putting @anna in her damn place.

          • anna says:

            to unreasonable – wouldn’t know about twitter….I don’t have one so don’t tweet anything to GG or anyone else….as far as what you see….you can see whatever romance you want – over on fanfic.net, where romance for this show belongs….

            Hey Gabi – voice of unreason isn’t ‘jesus’….and will never put anyone who doesn’t like ziva in their place….but have fun dreaming that might happen in between homework assignments

          • Gabi says:

            Anna, anna, anna…
            I did learn a few things with those homework assignments, one of those being a HYPERBOLE. It’s literary device and it means an exaggeration. I used that when I said “Jesus of words”. And @voiceofreason did out you in your place, not that you’d ever admit it.

          • srsly says:

            Obviously, VoR, when they write Ziva as being an antisocial witch with entitlement issues and Cote is stuck with three expressions: constipated, wibbly, or pissy, it is what it is. The writers made Ziva throw an injured Tony to the ground – you just want to dismiss it along with the rest of her actions and words. It doesn’t make all of those scenes go away no matter how much you wish it. As for the “hate” on twitter or whatever: I’d rather see fans ask a writer for their rationale on the direction a character takes than the vitriol the tivanistas regularly spew towards anyone, including cast/crew members, who say anything which is not favorable to the princess, relationships on the show in general, or their particular relationship. this vitriol is usually offensive and directed at real people and not the characters. Seeing those idiots who directly accuse MW of cheating on his wife and bragging about verbally assaulting her at the supermarket is way over the line. How about those tivas who circulated the defaced picture of his child and questioned her real parentage? Anyone can see who really has HATE in their hearts for any real person who disagrees with their fantasy and who is horrified by the message the show is sending and bored to tears with Mossad Mary Sue’s many catastrophies of her own making and just wants to see their tv show not fall down a problematic rabbit hole.

          • Gabi says:

            Please stop. Idk how you can have so much hate in your heart over a character on a TV show and an actress that you don’t even know. Pretty sure that’s not healthy.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @srsly – You say they write Ziva as an antisocial witch and Cote is stuck with three expressions: constipated, wibbly, or pissy!!! At least you are showing your true colors for all to see now!!
            Also, you keep harping back to S6 episodes to make your point. Need I say AGAIN, you need to move on from the Dark Ages and get up with the play about what is happening in S10.
            Re the things you proclaim that some fans have done about MW, IF there is any truth to that, then I agree that such behavior is disgusting. It doesn’t matter to me whether people who behave badly are pro or anti Tiva. It is wrong whoever does it. And it needs to stop. This is when lines get crossed between reality and fantasy, and real people get hurt.

  37. Bran says:

    Another thing is, NCIS TPTB are just being dicks. Seriously, they ruined one of the best Tiva scenes for nothing and what did it accomplish? It made people hate Ziva even more than they did. And people felt sorry for Tony, even more than they already did. Ugh.

    • anna says:

      which scene are you referring to?

      • Gabi says:

        Yeah, I would like to know what scene you’re talking about because Ziva has always appreciated the things Tony has done for her, it takes her a while sometimes but eventually she’s super appreciative.

      • Bran says:

        The whole “You’re not alone” scene in Shiva and then the whole thing where she slept with Adam and told Tony, “I felt alone.”

        • Gabi says:

          Oh so you’re saying she should’ve slept with Tony rather than Adam? Well yes, me too.

          • Bran says:

            Not at all. What I’m saying it, it just wasn’t needed at all. Period. What point did it have? It just made her look foolish and extremely hurtful, especially saying, “I felt alone” after what he said in Shiva. Seriously, TPTB, that’s the best you could come up with? So, they break Tony heart only to get, “awkwardness in our f-f-f-friendship?” Really? Ugh. Ridiculous.

            I’d love to see Tony happy once. Just freakin’ once.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            LOL Gabi. I personally think that the Adam storyline was a mistake that may actually cost GG more than he ever imagined. As Bran says below, “it just made her look foolish and extremely hurtful, especially saying, “I felt alone” after what he said in Shiva”. If GG did that as a mechanism to send Tiva back to “awkwardness in our f-f-f-friendship?”, so he didn’t have to address how close to canon they had become in Berlin, then he has less integrity and creativity as a showrunner than I would have hoped. As Bran says, I also would like to see Tony happy just frakin once!! The only consolation to “Adam” was that it occurred before Berlin, but still, it did ruin the You Are Not Alone
            Tiva moment for me, which is ridiculous. Why would a showrunner purposely ruin an amazing memorable moment like that and then expect Tiva fans not to be really angry with him about it. He is walking a fine line with stunts like this.

          • anna says:

            Bran – the point was similar to the point in Recoil when ziva slept with a guy she picked up in a bar….

  38. Sandy says:

    I saw the blacklist trailer and I liked it …

  39. CJ says:

    I’ve heard a lot of positives about Brooklyn Nine-Nine this week and now I’m even more excited for it :) Thanks for the scoops, as always!

  40. CA says:

    What I got from the NCIS spoiler is – blah blah blah, words, blah, tiva and more words.
    I’m just waiting for the day when we get a spoiler or news or whatever about the show without having the same old, same old tiva debate.

    • mimi says:

      Exactly. That’s what I do not understand. I know for sure that many fans (including me) have asked no-tiva related spoilers/info many times, but they just choose questions about tiva. Why?!
      NCIS is much more than a fake (abusive) love story between two people who have nothing in common.
      NCIS is a drama show about a federal agency, its agents, US Navy and US Marine Corps and not a soap-opera with a dead body here and there.
      What about an answer to this: how GG & Co. are going to fix the mess of this last season arc since they changed a team of Federal Agents into a gang of criminals who think that laws do not apply to them?

  41. 4luvofncis says:

    Thanks, Matt, for your commentary. Very legitimate questions regarding NCIS. IMO, the show, regardless of showrunner, has kind of cursed itself with this TIVA debate. I would much rather see a more balanced fan base, and the constant teasing has separated this topic from the fiber of the show & divided the fans along the lines of strictly TIVA. I want them to follow through with what THEY have written, whether that’s about TIVA or another relationship. If most everyone agrees that the draw of this show is it’s characters and relationships, a romance is just one facet in a set of relationships & is in and itself a “character-ship.” If everyone agrees that Tony & Ziva have incredible chemistry & sexual tension, it stands to reason that they would have a romance, naturally. And that’s what I think most “TIVA” fans are asking for – for the show to naturally follow through with what its written. People say that this is open to interpretation, & of course it is, but if you take things literally for the past 7 seasons, lay Tony & Ziva’s story out in front of you linearly, it is a “more than friends” relationship at the heart. Don’t justify not writing it or writing it with “this will make or break NCIS.” That’s just nonsense driven by fear instead of creativity & integrity. Will fans then complain that not enough intimacy is show when they are finally together? Who cares! People find things to complain about, it’s the human condition! And lastly, Michael Weatherly is not against his character having a romance w/Cote’s character or building a love story within everything else this show is about. He’s against the trivialization of their work being whittled down to nothing but a cute couple name. I have enough faith in the collective talent & morale of this show, given all the cast returns, to write whatever the hell they want & still be just as successful if not more so.

    • Oh, I agree with this 110%. Thank you for saying this.

    • Gina says:

      Thank you, Thank you, Thank you.

    • Katie says:

      Brilliant post.
      If Tiva is happening, people are going to complain. If Tiva doesn’t happen, people are going to complain. But the majority of fans (I think it was 80%, can’t be sure though, it was awhile ago) either want Tiva or wouldn’t care if it went either way, and the minority didn’t want them together. While the writers will try to appeal both sides, they will ultimately go for the majority.

      • 4luvofncis says:

        Thanks. Exactly. Fans who are not thrilled w/the idea of TIVA will simply say that the Extra poll is not reliable. Which, I kind of agree with, because one person can vote a million times, & most likely only people that care about TIVA will vote. But it also puts a light finger on the pulse of NCIS fans. If NCIS/CBS REALLY cared about what the fan base thought & that this REALLY influenced their decision, they would set up a reliable poll.

        • Lillian says:

          How can you say people can vote multiple times and then in the next breath (sentence) say it puts a finger on the pulse of the fans. That’s crazy. It puts a pulse on the finger of the TIVA fans, that’s about it. If Tiva was so fantastic, why did Tiva/Ziva heavy re-runs do so badly, with Shabbat Shalom and Shiva only garnering 7 million viewers? NCIS reruns have gotten at least 13M in the past.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            I was simply saying it’s somewhat of a representation. Just because people can vote a million times doesn’t mean they did or do. I can’t answer the question about reruns. Perhaps viewership is down in general, & it has nothing to do with the specific episode. Perhaps it’s the 4th or 5th rerun of the same episode.

          • Lillian says:

            They DO vote multiple times, one need only read the comments from Tiva fans on Twitter, Tumblr and Facebook to know that they “call out the troops,” so no, it’s not an accurate representation of fans, but a representation of the power of social media to get people to cheat. Remember too, that a vast majority of fans of Tiva/Ziva who are voting are international and mean nothing to ratings, which is what CBS and TPTB care about.

          • tatiana says:

            I have a question liliana why put in all your posts Tiva/Ziva fan?
            Ziva is my favorite character, and that does not mean that I ship her with tony.
            Actually I don’t like tony I would rather have Ziva and McGee.

          • Lillian says:

            tatiana: Apologies, not all Ziva fans are Tiva fans. I do tend to lump them together because the Tiva fans are so LOUD.

          • SAM says:

            If they were so terrible, why were they the two highest rated first run episodes of the season?

          • 4luvofncis says:

            Thank you SAM. I was waiting for someone to say that. :)

          • Lillian says:

            The key, SAM, is do people come back to watch it again. People will almost always try a first-run episode, but if they truly loved it, they’d watch it multiple times. Look at the USA marathons. Apparently, most viewers had something else to do during those re-runs.

          • tatiana says:

            Liliana I’m not a tiva fan but I do love those episodes, so they are saved on my tv, so I don’t have to watch re-runs when I can see it whenever you want.

          • tatiana says:

            sorry is lilian I’ve been saying your name wrong

          • kajar says:

            I have to snark here because, LILLIAN, that is the biggest crock of BS I have ever read. I’ve been a fan of NCIS since the beginning; seen every episode. But I’m also a fairly busy person and have neither the time nor the inclination to watch reruns of episodes I have already seen (unless I happen to catch them in passing later). Reruns are not appointment viewing for me. That doesn’t make me any less of a “true fan” or imply that I didn’t “truly” love those episodes (which, for the record, I thought were stellar…truly). Go sell it somewhere else.

      • estefania says:

        I second that

    • Gaara says:

      This, this

    • estefania says:

      totally agree

  42. Joe says:

    On NCIS, Why are people calling her “Tiva’ i though her name is ZIVA?

  43. Katie says:

    I have not been an NCIS fan for very long (only since last summer), but that doesn’t make me any less of a devote fan.
    Unfortunately, using the comments on this article isn’t really a reliable source for finding out how many people would stop watching if Tiva became cannon. On different sites the fan to shipper ratio varies greatly. Here, about 1/3 of the commenters don’t ship it. But if you went on Tumblr, about 90% of NCIS bloggers do. So you can’t really rely soley on this website commenters.
    I really like Tiva, and I’ll be honest. The will-they won’t-they tease drives me up the hall. But though I would be very disappointed if they didn’t get together, I wouldn’t stop watching the show.
    I think a lot (not all) of non-Tiva fans think that we watch NCIS almost soley for the Tiva, when in reality, most of us love Gibbs and McGee just as much as we love Tony and Ziva. We can be enthustiastic about more than just two characters.
    It has been eight years. Tony and Ziva have been shown in many different ways over the seasons that they care about each other. For those of you who say that Tony is just Ziva’s shadow, there are plenty of instances he has spectacular moments when Ziva’s not around (like when he saved Gibbs from drowning after his car went off the dock, for one example).
    Non-shippers seem so sure that if they got together, the show would become centered around them. But how do they know? “Because that’s how it is right now!” Um, no. I did some math, and a little research of my own, and found that on average there’s two minutes of Tiva in the normal season 10 episode. Out of forty minutes. That means 5% of the actual episode is Tiva screen time (not including centric episodes like Berlin and Shiva). You don’t KNOW how Tiva would play out if it became cannon. So far, the writers do a brilliant job. If these people were true fans, they would trust the show and wait and see how it goes before they start judging.
    I’m also annoyed people are saying that Ziva is abusive. How? Because she makes a few mistakes? Gibbs shot the person who killed his family and broke laws often. Tony has bad committment issues (and so far the only constant woman in his life has been Ziva. No surprise he’s getting close to her). McGee has little confidence in himself. Ziva has had her entire family killed, grew up as an assassin, and she can’t be a little emotionally unstable?
    I hope Tiva get together at the very lastest, half-way through the final ever season. So we at least get to see some of their relationship.

    • Katie says:

      My bad, I did the math wrong. It’s actually be 7%, not 5%. Sorry.

    • 4luvofncis says:

      I love that you used a “ziva-ism!” LOL. Very good points all around. I don’t know why there is so much “hullabaloo” about a romance on NCIS. Like I said, the show just about epitomizes every other kind of relationship (missing the mother-child), what the hell is wrong w/a love story? if people are going to throw the rule book at me, why is it okay to have every other type of relationship & boundary crossing & not romance? 2nd of all rule 12 isn’t about not falling in love w/co-workers, it’s about not making a mistake & not respecting or trusting your co-worker.

      • Gabi says:

        Thank you. Ncis is like a big family. There has to be a couple too :)

      • anna says:

        Rule 12 – Never date a co-worker….

        How in the world does that translate into ‘don’t make a mistake and don’t disrepect or mistrust your co-worker’

        • SAM says:

          As NCIS doesn’t frown on its agents being involved with one another, in the end Rule 12 doesn’t stand. Besides which, the man who created it also wanted to explore two agents on the same team being involved with one another. Sounds to me like DPB wanted to have some conflict and drama and tension regarding all of that because it would make for entertaining viewing.

          • Gabi says:

            @SAM
            My words exactly. I think Gibbs wants them together. I think he sees it. He Is a romantic, that Gibbs :)

          • L. Burke says:

            It would in Tony’s and Ziva’s case. Tony is her direct Superior in her direct chain of command. So yes, Law Enforcement Fraternization rules and policies WOULD apply in this case.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            I don’t think it has been established that Tony is her direct supervisor, and I don’t think that’s how it works. He is senior to her, having been there longer. But Gibbs if all of their direct supervisors.

          • L.Burke says:

            Ah, yeah Tony is her direct supervisor as the SFA. The chain of command would technically go Gibbs, Tony as his 2IC who leads the team when Gibbs isn’t there or can’t. Then by seniority McGee and then Ziva. So yes, Tony IS Ziva’s direct supervisor. That’s even cannon by the ‘hazing’ episodes where Ziva became an agent. Tony dumped his work on McGee who gleefully dumped on the new ‘probie’ Ziva’s desk.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            So then EJ & Tony broke fraternization rules because she has higher seniority than him (even higher than Gibbs it was said at one point) because as someone else stated these rules don’t have anything to do with being on the same team?

          • anna says:

            @4luv thinking you need to look up what it means to be the senior field agent….that means he’s one step below Gibbs and is in charge when Gibbs isn’t available. This was also established, IIRC, in the early seasons of the show before the mossad princess got there and thought she was better than the rest of them….
            It’s also evident in Bait (s3) when Tony automatically assumes command of the scene once Gibbs allows himself to be taken hostage with the other kids.

          • 4luvofncis says:

            I will post this here too: It doesn’t matter who & when they’re SFA. Yes, I’m quite aware of what that means. As far as I can tell, Tony is only Ziva’s next in command when Gibbs is not there. That does not make Tony her direct supervisor at all times. According to NCIS, the show, not the real world, “It’s not against NCIS policy to date co-workers.” Taken from Two-Faced. “NCIS doesn’t have a policy against it.” Taken from Dead Reflection. So regardless of the chain-of-command, who is SFA or JFA, the show is saying there is no policy against dating a co-worker, period. And I would like to see the policy of the real NCIS, not the military policy. But like I said, it doesn’t really matter. There isn’t an “NCIS policy” in the world of the CBS show: NCIS, barring Tony & Ziva from dating, and it really comes down to Gibbs & his team.

        • 4luvofncis says:

          because you are taking it very literal, & i do not think that was the writers’ intention. i hear it being said, as in “it’s not a very good idea,” as Gibbs explained in Two-Faced & Dead Reflection in season 8. also the history behind that rule has to do with Gibbs’ previous relationship w/Jenny, & Gibbs is trying to protect his team from making the same mistakes. but he is also biased because he got his heart broken by Jenny.

    • quickdraw59 says:

      Thank you, a very excellent comment. I watch NCIS for ALL of the characters, it matters nothing to me who does or does not get together. I have watched each character grow into what they have become and enjoyed the trip along the way. What truly annoys me is the constant lack of civility in the comments, grow up people, I’ve seen kindergartners who behave better.

    • Voice of Truth says:

      I almost didn’t answer this post but the stupid was too much for me so here goes:

      1. Why are you excluding the Tiva centric episodes from your percentage? Isn’t it precisely the point that an almost entirely Tiva centric episode would a) be exactly what we’d get if Tiva went romantic and b) it has an effect on the percentage! You can make a percentage say whatever you like if you exclude the one thing it’s measuring! Honestly, it’s the most pointless exercise in proving your point by flawed methodology that I’ve seen in probably forever.
      2. Gibbs is a corrupt LEO, no doubt about it. I can’t stand what they’ve done to the character after Mother’s Day but Matt wasn’t writing a spoiler about Gibbs so he isn’t the topic being discussed. I’m happy to discuss how much I think he belongs in jail and how I hate that the show presents him as some kind of hero when he really isn’t, and the glorification of his ‘integrity’ when he covers up the crimes or colludes in them when committed by his ‘family’, including ex-mothers-in-law and team members, but arrests people and presumably sends them to jail for the same crimes. I’d have a lot more respect for him if he’d stood up and admitted to the Hernandez murder from Day One – instead he just comes over as a great big coward who gives them impression he lives by a certain code when in fact he doesn’t – but he expects others to. However, Ziva is just as bad and it’s these two who are the worst rotten apples in the whole team. I’d argue that Gibbs has corrupted the entire team from the beginning onwards and if that was what the show was going to give us, then I’d enjoy that. But instead he’s presented as some kind of hero instead of the corrupt cop he actually is.
      3. No, Ziva isn’t the only constant woman in Tony’s life. If you’re counting ‘team mates’ then he’s been friends with Abby for longer. If you’re counting ACTUAL romantic relationships, which Tiva isn’t, then he had a relationship with Wendy for years. So no. That’s just plain wrong.

  44. foonts says:

    I think that was a very thoughtful answer with regards to the Tiva question. I have a certain amount of distaste for Ziva as a character and I feel that Tiva would be a bad pairing. But, putting aside my personal feelings, I think it is about time Gary makes up his mind about this relationship. I think the whole notion of Tony and Ziva having become closer this season is bogus. I don’t see them being any closer than they were last season or the season before that. Every season they keep doing the same dance over and over again and it has become incredibly tiring to watch. Even me, a Tiva hater, would prefer them going through with the relationship rather than another season of the same dance again. I can understand the fear about not wanting to upset the balance of the show but the argument does not hold much water for a show going into its 11th season. If it was in its 4th or 5th season, then I can understand the hesitancy because the makers would want the show to continue for a few more seasons and wouldn’t want to risk losing viewers. But now the show is going into its 11th season and its extremely likely that the show will now slowly start coming to an end. It’s about time they put this debate to rest. If they don’t want to go through with it, then end the teasing. If they want to go through with it then they should put them together and keep whatever romantic moments in the background so it doesn’t pull focus away from the cases. If they keep postponing it and one of Cote or Michael leave to do something else, then they will be massively stuck and will face a huge backlash from the Tiva shippers and the Tiva haters will slowly start leaving having become tired of the teasing.

    • Gabi says:

      Why don’t you like Ziva? I do appreciate how nice you were about it though, unlike most people on here. They’re SO mean

      • anna says:

        Not used to having a fictional bubble burst about a tv character? Ziva has been an inconceivable character since they first brought her on and she’s only gotten worse….

        • Gabi says:

          I was I asking the person that WASN’T rude about not liking Ziva.

        • SAM says:

          No Anna, she’s just not used to dealing with somebody so fanatacially devoted to denouncing a fictional TV character and the actress who plays her.

          • anna says:

            amazed then that she’s used to people who not only live & breathe the ziva bs (cdp silliness) but also seem to build their lives (including their vacations) around her

          • SAM says:

            Gosh Anna, I really don’t understand of what concern it is of yours who people decide to go on vacation with, or the where or the why.

  45. Kathi says:

    It really kills me when people on both sides of the Tiva fence say things like “most fans this” or “most fans that” – unless you have access to the thinking of more than 1/2 of the 20 million fans who watch this show, you are speaking assumptions or made up stats. The online NCIS fandom is about 2000 fans – far short of the total fanbase, so you can’t base fan likes/dislikes on what you see in the forums, boards, twitter, comments to articles like this, etc. It’s the same people commenting over and over and the opinions don’t change and neither do the comments.

    The showrunner is going to do what the showrunner is going to do. It doesn’t matter what the actors want or think, they get paid to act. It really doesn’t matter what the on-line fans want because until the ratings start to drop (and lets face it, that’s not going to happen no matter what he does with Tiva) he is going to have a free pass.

    I have a feeling that the real “majority” of the fans don’t care either way. They watch week after week and then forget about the show until the next Tuesday rolls around. It’s only the crazy 2000 (myself included) that obsess over character growth or non-growth, relationship developments or non-developments, storyline inconsistencies, etc.

    To the normal everyday fan (the19,998.000 who we will never hear from) it just doesn’t matter – one way or the other because they will keep tuning in as long as the team is there and Gibbs is charge. Period.

    • 4luvofncis says:

      True but if all of the media outlets are asking CBS & Gary this same question over & over again, it must be on the majority of the fans’ minds. Yes, this is an assumption, or rather, an educated guess. And just curious, how did you come with the # 2000 online fans?

      • Kathi says:

        The media love Tiva – if only because of the buzz /hits/ hype it builds on the online forums. You post something with Tiva in it and you are sure to get a significant number of responses because fans feel so strongly either way. While we may never know how the real majority of fans feel about Tiva, we do know that the on-line fandom has very strong feelings either way and aren’t shy about voicing those opinions. Look at this particular thread, Tiva comments are dominating. And the media is far stupid. They know what generates online traffic and Tiva delivers on that front. As long as fans are willing to talk about it – the media will use it.
        As for the 2000 online fans that was arrived at by a very complicated algorithm logging unique user names from available NCIS forums starting 5 years ago with a special consideration given to common names like Mary where more than one user could be commenting under that name. It looks at the actual comments and if one Mary appears to be (say) Pro-Tiva and another Mary appears to be Anti-Tiva, it is logged as two different unique users even though there is a common user name. I can’t even pretend to understand exactly how it works (and I am an engineer myself). It doesn’t look at comments for content – just users – so we don’t know for instance how many of the 2000 online fans are for or against Tiva or if users are commenting under different names, in which case the 2000 number would be over inflated. So while it is not a perfect number, it is still pretty good.

        • 4luvofncis says:

          Okay, gotcha. I really was curious, so thanks for explaining. And I do agree that there is a strong response either way, I can see your point. I guess maybe it’s on the minds of the majority of people who comment or post about NCIS? Yes I agree, not telling of a conclusive opinion of all fans of NCIS. :)

      • anna says:

        No, it’s most likely just that when they ask for questions about the show, all the tiva fans who tweet hurry up and fill their inboxes with ziva/tiva related questions. With that ratio in mind, they automatically reach for a tiva/ziva question since they believe it’s so popular

        • SAM says:

          Well Anna, if our numbers (and our fingers) are able to do such a thing, it would be an indication, that, yes, the subject is popular. If our numbers weren’t that high, or if the numbers of people like you were higher, we wouldn’t be able to do such a thing now, would we?

          • DeeJay says:

            Exactly. I have just read through all these comments and I had to jump in here. If the anti-Tiva fans were correct in their claims that there are not many fans who are supportive of Tiva getting together, that outcome would be more heavily reflected in the polls, facebook, tumblr and twitter content etc. If Tiva fans are able to magically conjure up endless online support at the drop of a hot for online blogs and polls, then surely the anti-Tiva group is equally able to conjure up such support? That line of reasoning just doesn’t wash.

            Also, the fact that there are viewers who are STILL crying out for the end of Ziva, some 8 years since Kate left the show, because they prefer Kate to Ziva, is ludicrous. Even if Ziva was written out, that would not bring Kate/Sasha back. It is time to move on, people, and embrace ALL of the characters. It makes me laugh how some of the anti-Tiva people who have commented on here suggest that the pro-Tiva fans are ONLY into Ziva and Tony; whereas the Ziva/Tiva haters fail to see that their blind disregard for Ziva is actually also blinding them to the developments and growth in Tony and Ziva that has occurred over these 8 years.

          • Gabi says:

            @DeeJay
            THANK YOU! I completely agree with you. I mean if you don’t see the growth that these two characters have made, idk what show you’re watching because these two have matured separately and as a duo. And THAT is pretty obvious.

          • Voice of Truth says:

            Dee Jay – it’s much easier to be INTO something and network with other people who are into it and spend all your days and nights photo-shopping Tony and Ziva in wedding outfits exchanging rings and posting them on Tumblr than it is to be in a community of those who DON’T like something, so your argument doesn’t stand up. Despite what you seem to think, there isn’t some big community of ‘antis’ spending their time photo-shopping photos of Tony and Ziva *apart*. I rarely ever hang out with or talk to other people who dislike Tiva and have no idea where I’d find them except occasionally in the comments section of articles like this. And the fact that despite that SO MANY are coming here to say we hate it, I think that’s a good indication of a widespread feeling against it. We can only react when there’s something ABOUT it though, either on the show or in articles, not 99% of the rest of the time which is what the Tiva fans seem to do.

            As for development and growth in either Tony or Ziva – don’t make me laugh. So, she’s grown out of her violent, sociopathic impulses, has she? No, wait – didn’t she just enact a revenge killing? As for Tony, he hasn’t remotely evolved – he’s *devolved* into a sad, middle-aged man who mopes around Gibbs’s basement complaining that he doesn’t have a family. Boo hoo. You don’t have a family, Tony, because TPTB have to keep the Tiva tease going endlessly which means you can never grow up and move on – you always have to be stuck in a perpetual Tiva groove.

          • Voice of Reason says:

            @Voice of Truth (who appears to have created this name and started posting in direct response to me, for some reason) — in one way I agree with you in that the continual stalling and unnecessary roadblocks that TPTB put in Tiva’s path are damaging to the characters. This is the exact point that the person who asked the question to TVLine was making – putting Tiva on percolate indefinitely, as I said earlier, and keeping them in a holding pattern is not working any longer. As we approach S11 it is time to stop with the games and either let Tiva work out a relationship together or move them on to other people that they will be happy with. It is TPTB dragging Tiva out for FAR too long that is creating the issues that you have raised, imho, and not any innate deficiency in either Tony or Ziva’s characters. Both COULD be written well together if TPTB chose to do so. But it seems GG is content to just keep them in this pattern of making slow progress towards a committed relationship but not actually getting them there until the end of the series. THAT is what is ruining the character integrity – in my view, anyway. And this is becoming annoying to people who love Tiva, as well as those who hate Tiva (bec they hate Ziva). It is time for Gary to wise up and deal with Tiva once and for all.

    • Amber says:

      I completely agree with this. I only recently starting looking online because i wanted to know if Cote had signed a contract. I am completely amazed by all the different sides of Tiva love and Tiva hate. Personally, I like Tiva but at the end of the day will they or wont that doesnt make me watch the show. I have been reading on different boards and am amazed by how far people go on both sides of this debate. I have seen both sides get very rude to each other and at the end of the day its a TV show and everyone is allowed to there own opinion. As long as ratings stay high why would they change anything??? Sad to say that eventually the numbers will start falling and it will not be based on the story line at the time but more on the fact that this is the 11th season and people will find other interesting shows. S.H.I.E.L.D. is going to be a big problem at first for NCIS I believe because of the younger group. Depending on how S.H.I.E.L.D. does may alter NCIS’s future.

      • DeeJay says:

        Now I am on a roll and replying to everything – LOL. I agree with you about S.H.I.E.L.D, Amber. I think the ballgame is about to change, potentially quite dramatically. Younger viewers have less tolerance for eternal dragging out of their “ships”, as they call them, and are more inclined to move on to something else. If SHIELD does well and is more 21st Century in it’s approach to romance, NCIS may really feel it in the ratings.

        • Gabi says:

          Well yeah, I mean I know I’m only one person. But I will ship tiva till the day I die and I’m NOT interested at all in that new show. I think we should stick to the classics and people are trying to give us more and more cop shows. I must admit SOME are good like motive, but none of them compare to ncis and I will follow this show till the end.

      • Lori says:

        Again, people are assuming that tumbl, Twitter, and polls accurately represent everyone who watches the show. It does not. Not everyone who watches the show votes in the polls. Not everyone participates in online discussion. I rarely do. And regarding “the same no-Tiva fans” commenting. I recognize most of the pro-Tiva fans commenting over and over again.

        • Amber says:

          This works both ways. I have seen both groups do this. To call out one group over the other is not fair. Its funny because both groups seem to accuse each other of the same things. Obviously, everyone has the write to what ever group they want to support. No pole will every be accurate. Heck they have trouble keeping the presidential pole from having fraud.

  46. Renee says:

    Thanks Matt. I’m really looking forward to your reviews of the new shows.

  47. John says:

    Tiva? The test ran that in Paris and from all evidence weren’t that impressed. So I’d say leave it at that.

    Gibbs? I miss that truly hot redhead with those great cars that used to pick him up…. (and yes I know who that was). He always grinned really big when he dropped into that passenger seat. Definitely like more grinning Gibbs (as compared to the Jamie Lee Curtis creepfest…)

  48. Gabi says:

    I love TIVA with all of my heart. I think they’re SO beyond perfect together and I think that if they don’t at least END UP together, I’ll be really upset. I mean, I’ll still ship them but.. i don’t know. I just think that they love each other so very much, that I don’t see these characters being with anybody else. They are such complex characters and they just fit so beautifully together. I think that Gibbs wouldn’t even follow up on Rule 12 with these two because he sees it too. I think that they really deserve each other’s love and that they belong together. I love TIVA so much ♥ PLEASE GARYYYYY.

    • anna says:

      Tony deserves love alright…the kind he got from Paula or Jeanne or what he used to get from Abby before she was babified….

      ziva just needs to exit stage right permanently

      • SAM says:

        Again, in your opinion, Anna, that’s what she needs to do. Yours is not the majority opinion, by a long shot.

        And in response to an earlier point — yeah, I think it’s pretty well estalished that Tony will move heaven or earth for a member of his team. But I don’t remember in any of the instances that you gave that Tony said he couldn’t live without them. Whereas in “ToC”, it’s clearly shown that he’s letting himself go without Ziva there, a process that speeds up, by his own admission once he’s told that she’s dead — that little thing about everything losing its meaning.

        As for not backing up what he said there, about not being able to live without her — um, again, think “ToC” pretty much gives plenty of examples of his actions backing up those words. His actions back up his words again in “Pyramid”, to the point that even EJ notices — and gets it. Plenty of other examples I can give to prove I’m right about this.

        Oh, and while I’m sure Weatherly and de Pablo were made aware that there were going to be visitors to the set that day, they did not know they were there when they were shooting a scene together, and cutting up and having fun together after they finished. They got introduced to them a while after that had happened.

        Oh, and I’m sorry, but you were clearly on Twitter during the middle of last summer. May have been your first time on it in three years at that point, but yeah, that was you. But hey, I’m sure it just slipped your mind. Easy to understand why it would, under the circumstances.

  49. Patrick Maloney says:

    I totally forgot Eion Bailey was on Covert Affairs, especially such a pivotal role in the show’s history

  50. Ram510 says:

    I’m surprised to hear Trophy Wife is high on your list. I will have to check it out. I would’ve guessed it’d be one of the first to be cancelled. Can’t wait for Brooklyn nine-nine, haven’t had this much anticipation for a Fox show in quite sometime. Sleepy Hollow looked ok but now I’ve been warned, thanks